PL 2016-2017 Thread

[edd_jedi]

To me its the best chance of a trophy for most of the top 6

Completely agree, it's the most prestigious cup for the least effort. I commend Arsenal for winning it twice recently. It baffles me why so many teams don't take it seriously. I would much rather see Spurs win the FA Cup than come 2nd or 3rd in the league, which is meaningless.

 

[theforceuk]

I agree completely, would I have swapped Man Utd winning the FA Cup for finishing 2nd, 3rd or 4th in the league last season.

No chance, I would even take the League Cup over that.

 

[edd_jedi]

I've honestly never understood the hoo-ha about the Champions League, I know money is the answer to that but as a competition it does little to prove which is the best team in Europe, it's basically blind luck depending on your draws. It's five years since a British club won it and I can't see another winner any time soon.

 

[weasel]

most little clubs have no chance of winning it but there is always the chance for an upset, just as its always been. Can you really tell fans of Wigan, Portsmouth and Liverpool that the cup has lost its magic :lol:

I'm not biting I'm just sat here looking at a PL table :lol:

touche :lol: (but dont get a nosebleed)

Ohh I don't expect it to last too long. It's Liverpool, they'll find a way to **** it up.

I've honestly never understood the hoo-ha about the Champions League, I know money is the answer to that but as a competition it does little to prove which is the best team in Europe, it's basically blind luck depending on your draws. It's five years since a British club won it and I can't see another winner any time soon.

I do prefer the CL over the FAC, more from a novelty point of view, you don't get to see all of the sides in it every week on TV over here, and some do have different styles of play to those predominating in the UK. Granted you can say you don't get to see Preston (say) every week on tv, and that's true, and there is a lot of repetition in the CL (same old same old dozen sides) but it's the trips to Hungary to play Ferenecvaros (spelling) that are the novelty.
I do think the CL is dying just as much of a death as the FAC, and for the same reason. Money
If we sat down the day the group stage was drawn I reckon we could have predicted 13-15 of the teams to qualify. Now that's exciting! :roll:
Fans are starting to cotton on to the fact that half the teams in it are purely cannon fodder. Where's the excitement/interest/novelty value in watching Barca/Real/Bayern/Juve/Utd/Arsenal playing out a routine 3-1 win away to Anderlecht? Everyone knows Anderlecht won't win and don't have a chance of making the next round, so why bother watching.
I think I saw somewhere that CL viewing figures are down massively since they moved to BT sport. Hardly surprising. I think they had been falling for years before that as well, not just in the UK cos you could blame that on English sides not doing as well, but continent wide. No doubt UEFA in their wisdom will decide that the best thing to do is guarantee more games between the big teams, cos that's what everyone wants to see. :roll:
The best thing they could do is (and the same goes for the WC and Euro Champs, rather than enlarge them..) drop the seeding. So what if you get Barca, Bayern and City in one group. It means all three sides will be forced to take every game seriously. And if we end up with Copenhagen, Olympiakos and Celtic in another group, big deal! Someone else makes the knock out stages. NOVELTY VALUE!!!

Not sure how you restore the magic of the FAC though. Short of the FA putting a zero on the prize money to make sides/accountants take it much more seriously.

 

[edd_jedi]

Not sure how you restore the magic of the FAC though. Short of the FA putting a zero on the prize money to make sides/accountants take it much more seriously.

I'm sure they could enforce putting out a competitive side, it would be easy to police as currently teams are putting out players that haven't played a single PL game. I'm sure in tennis it is against regulations to throw a match, this is the same principal. Perhaps they are forced to put out a full strength squad with the exception of three players or something. That's what is killing it, who wants to watch "Liverpool" or "Spurs" in the FA Cup when you don't recognise any of the players?

 

[weasel]

Fair enough suggestion. The only issue is going to be enforcing it.
It could end up like International football. Look how many times Giggsy was "injured" and unavailable for Wales but magically recovered to play 90 mins for Utd 3 days later. I could see a lot of players suddenly picking up niggles, or being told to limp off when they are subbed 5 mins from the end of the previous league game.
Cynical, me!? No! Lol

 

[edd_jedi]

This weekends results have really evened up the top of the table, so little between 2nd-6th with only Chelsea looking stronger than the others at the moment. Despite City's shite performance today I think Spurs will ether lose or draw against them next weekend and I expect them to be 4th this time next week.

Speaking of City I don't hear many people slagging off Guardiola yet. It must be a real wake up call for these managers who come from leagues where there is no real competition and it's now hard to even get in to the top four. I wonder why English teams fare so badly in the Champions League and why Spanish teams dominate it when the PL is far more competitive. Do Real and Barcelona stay so good just by playing each other?

 

[lejackal]

There are two or three other clubs that can compete and will take them on but that's about it, they're probably just more rested, not because of the winter break but because they only have to give 100% for 10 games a season domestically, in the PL you pretty much need to be 100% for all 38 games.
If someone could tell that to Arsenal that would be great

 

[weasel]

I haven't seen the Everton City game but it sounds like City were piss poor. Zabaleta as a holding midfielder!? REALLY!? His legs have gone meaning he struggles at RB so the obvious place to put him in the one spot that probably requires the most running. Ok, Pirlo got away without needing to run much but ehhh at no stage in his career has Zabaleta ever looked like Pirlo. Plus Pirlo was a midfielder who adapted him game to his diminishing pace. Not a RB who got thrown in at the deep end.
Very strange.


Spuds looked good against West Brom. Baggies were all over the place in the first half, it could have been a cricket score. I dunno if it was Spuds playing really well, Baggies having a stinker or both, but fair dos to Spuds for taking advantage.


As for Utd Pool, WTF was Pogba doing? When Utd spunked 95 million buying him back I don't quite think that's the kind of 'game changer' they had in mind. How he stayed on beyond half time I will never know. A tad annoying as Liverpool, that Utd's goal was so clearly offside. Close calls I can accept, but that wasn't close. What the linesman was doing in that position I will never know. I hope he's off to League two this week. Saying that, I don't begrudge Utd getting a point. It was a fairly even game and Utd had enough decent chances that they deserved a point. Although you don't always get what you deserve in football.
If I was a Utd fan though I'd still be a tad disappointed that this long into Mourinho's Utd career and 'Plan B' is STILL hoof long balls at Sideshow Bob. Surely a club of Utd's stature and with their manager's experience they could think up a better 'Plan B' than that!?
Yes, Liverpool sat quite deep and looked to hit them on the break, but so did a lot of sides when Utd were in their pomp and I don't remember Fergy resorting to long ball with twenty mins left.

I also thought Firminio was lucky not to be sent off for shoving Herrera. Yes, Herrarra had just put in the most ridiculous shirt pull (did yer Arsenal boy who's name starts with an X not get a straight red for a deliberate cynical foul at the start of the season? and Herera gets a yellow!? Blaming the referees there not saying Utd got lucky) but Firminio reacted and raised his hands. Ok, he hit him in the chest, not the face as Herera made out, but still, he reacted and players have been sent off for that.
Apparently Rooney put in a stinker of a tackle on Milner, but I totally missed it. So maybe that evens up.

 

[weasel]

It all boils down to money. Sadly.

The BBC and BT sport don't help either. They spout on about the magic of the cup and what games did they televise, WH v's Man City, geee you don't get to see them play very often. Ohhh wait, they are playing each other in the PL next month........and it's being televised! :roll:
They also showed, Utd, Pool and Arsenal. Again, never see those sides playing at all.
Why not show some of the minnows, some of the teams that never get shown on tv? The Leeds game was on last night, but even they are probably one of the 'biggest' sides in the Championship.

I saw a stat somewhere that said something along the lines of 90% (if not more) of Man Utd's FAC games have been chosen for television over the last 5-10 years. Sad. I get that Utd are the biggest team in the country and more people will watch them, but what does that say about the magic of the cup, and what does it do for fans of lower league sides who rarely get to see their side on tv.

Money money money.

And surprise surprise the games chosen to be televised in round 4 are, Man U's, Arsenal's, Liverpool's and Leeds. :roll: zzzzzzz

The first three have hardly got tricky games. You would expect Pool and Utd to win theirs 9 times out of 10. Arsenal Saints could be tricky, but again 8 or more times out of 10 Arsenal win that. Leeds shown for the second round in a row, albeit they play Sutton Utd so benefit of the doubt as I think Sutton are the lowest rank side left in it.
Still hardly much imagination shown by the TV execs there. Magic of the cup.

 

[weasel]

Edd, i think you'll have to stop saying Arsenal are lucky. Spuds could be 4/5-1 down here. That was a stone wall penalty and a red card, Spuds go up the other end and equalise. Poor Pep.


Ohh and Swansea :roll:
Pool unbeaten against top 6. Picked up most pts in games between those sides in that mini league tabel and yet they lose to Swansea, Burnley and Bournemouth. THAT is why they won't win the league. CL will b a great season for them.

 

[edd_jedi]

Agreed, that's one of the worst Spurs performances I've ever seen, up there with the game against Newcastle last season. I would have been genuinely embarrassed if they had won. The only thing I can grasp at is that neither of City's goals should have gone in, both complete freak cock ups by Lloris. But they could have scored a few more and agree should have been a penalty. All going Chelsea's way so far this weekend!

 

[edd_jedi]

No Arsenal aren't lucky, they just get a 96th minute penalty for a player who is offside :lol: still it's exactly how I expected the table to look after this weekend, bar Liverpool anyway

 

[weasel]

Yeah. I caught the very last kick of the Arsenal game. I assumed at 1-0 and down to ten they would shut it out. It sounds like I missed a decent game. Saw a picture of the offside, not even close. WTF the linesman was doing i'll never know. That's two piss poor decisions from linesmen in a week.
Hull should have had a pen,aty today as well, but you'd still have expected Chelsea to win it. Pains me to say it but they are looking like they have it wrapped up already.
For the sake of there being a decent title race this year we really need Liverpool and Arsenal to beat Chelsea in the next two games. If Chelsea win them both that's game over. Even two draws is probably enough for them.

 

[weasel]

Always said the League cup was a crap competition anyway :lol:

Fair play to Saints they deserved, over the 180 mins the score line flattered Liverpool. Massively.

1 win in 2017, and that was at the second attempt against the mighty Plymouth. Still an easy one against Wolves on Saturday then 3 points on a plate against Chelsea on Tuesday. I wouldn't be surprised to see Wolves name in the hat for the 5th round. I don't know why but it just looks like every single Liverpool player has gone off the boil simultaneously. Which is nice. Ohh, and fair do's to Karius, he made 2 or 3 superb saves last night.

 

[edd_jedi]

I caught the second half but it looked like one of those games where things just didn't go Liverpool's way. In the last few minutes there could have been a penalty, and Foster was bloody lucky that fumble didn't go in

 

[theforceuk]

I've watched Liverpool a lot over the last couple of weeks and I'm genuinely perplexed by there form, especially there inability to take chances at Anfield. I mean up until the new year they were banging in 3 or 4 goals a game, seems to me it all started in that last half hour at Bournemouth when they were 3 - 1 up and lost 4 - 3.

I agree over the 2 legs the better team whent through but I have to say if Liverpool had taken one of those early chances it would have been a different game and outcome IMO, although Southampton could have been 2 - 0 up at half time.

Don't get me wrong I'm happy they are out, but I've learnt in Football nothing is over until it's over, would anyone be suprised if Southampton won it? In a way it's disappointing that Liverpool aren't in the final as the only team of note Man Utd have knocked out is a second string City side. Spose why it's called the worthless cup. :roll:

As for the league Chelsea don't even look convincing anymore, problem is knowone else does either. So Chelsea have probably already done enough to get over the line. Long way to go yet though, it doesn't seem long ago people were asking if anyone could beat City and if Conte was going to get sacked.

 

[weasel]

As for Chelsea, I agree they don't look amazing but the lead they have should be enough to get them over the line. Especially given the number in their squad who won the title a few years ago and also when you consider how inconsistent everyone else in the league is. I just can't see Chelsea dropping enough points AND someone else putting together a good enough run to catch them.

As for Liverpool. It is a weird one, they aren't actually playing THAT badly. Someone said it was because they are knackered from all the pressing, but they are still running about as much as they have and the last 10 mins was like the siege at the Alamo. So I don't think fitness is the problem. I think it's more a case of 3 or 4 things added together. Lallana has gone off the boil after his brilliant purple patch in Nov/Dec. Coutinho was out for a few weeks and is still rusty. Mane fecked off to ACN, that was a big loss. Sturridge and Origi are good players but they don't fit that system so when one plays you have a square peg in a round hole. Add in a collective loss of form, a touch of misfortune (Utd's off-side goal, though they deserved a point) and a small squad with limited real options (bar promising kids, lucas and Moreno*) and hey presto. One win in seven.


*Who is barely worthy of being called a "footballer"

 

[edd_jedi]

A few surprise FA cup results this weekend, didn't see the Liverpool game but obviously surprised they are out. Spurs were incredibly lucky, although they put out the part timers and they played most of the second half with ten men due to an injury (not the best idea to use all your subs with 30 mins left) they shouldn't have got to two down in the first place, not acceptable against a team several tiers below them. If a premier league reserve team can't comfortably beat a league two first team, there's a problem. Hopefully they take it a bit more seriously in the next round.

Brighton and Leeds both out to minnows too! Looks like Arsenal and Utd were the only teams to take it seriously this weekend.

 

[theforceuk]

Think Spurs struggled because of the lack of match sharpness, but I agree they should still have won comfortably.

I can't believe what I'm seeing with Liverpool, to loose those three home games in a row is shocking. Thing is with football there is always another game if they can beat Chelsea at Anfield then the seasons back on for them.

Was impressed with Arsenal turning Southampton over like that. :shock: