PL 2018-2019 Thread
- Thread starter lejackal
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weasel said:
I think a bit of perspective is important for Utd at the moment. They remind me a bit of Arsenal - they think a history of success somehow entitles them to success in the present. It doesn't work that way. Look at it logically, neither are anywhere near City and playing catch-up with the other three teams above them. IMO Utd were lucky to finish second last season, they simply are not good enough to be in the top four at the moment. And the fact they won the treble 19 years ago doesn't change that. Jose is doing OK, it could be worse.
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Perspective is looking at a club with the biggest turnover in the world and biggest fan base in the world and recognizing that the club is not being run correctly from the top. So yes I agree Utd has become similar to Arsenal in that respect. I can slag City and Chelsea off, but at the end of the day their owners care about getting results on the pitch and that's the difference. JM is one of the only influential figures at the club that has exacting standards and I'm talking about the performance level, not the way he conducts himself.
The club's a joke, I missed out on tickets for tonights game in the ballot, tonight their selling tickets at the gate to the general public. Ridiculous.
As for Man Utd not deserving 2nd last season that's subjective, the league table never lies and we finished 4 points infront of 3rd and 19 points behind City.
The club's a joke, I missed out on tickets for tonights game in the ballot, tonight their selling tickets at the gate to the general public. Ridiculous.
As for Man Utd not deserving 2nd last season that's subjective, the league table never lies and we finished 4 points infront of 3rd and 19 points behind City.
theforceuk said:
I heard Utd were struggling to sell all the tickets for the game, that says it all really.
theforceuk said:
Let's be honest, last year it was City and then the rest. 2nd or 6th it made no difference everyone was miles and miles behind City.
League tables don't lie, I agree, but they are affected by how well teams do in Europe. Jose prioritised EL over PL a few yrs ago. Wherever Utd finished that yr was probably artificially low.
There wasn't much between the also rans last year, but see my initial point about everyone being so far behind City it was irrelevant.
spoons
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Until recently Arsenal have had one of the highest wage bills and highest ticket prices in thre league, which is why Arsenal fans expect better, nothing to do with past success
https://www.planetfootball.com/quick-reads/a-club-by-club-breakdown-of-wages-in-the-premier-league-championship/
But with now only the 5th highest salary 4th would be over achieving.
On the flip side Tottenham have massively over achieved the past couple of years based on their wage bill
In reality Spurs pay too little and Arsenal pay too much - wish it was the other way around :lol:
https://www.planetfootball.com/quick-reads/a-club-by-club-breakdown-of-wages-in-the-premier-league-championship/
But with now only the 5th highest salary 4th would be over achieving.
On the flip side Tottenham have massively over achieved the past couple of years based on their wage bill
In reality Spurs pay too little and Arsenal pay too much - wish it was the other way around :lol:
I can see why that's frustrating, but again I don't think looking at salaries is using logic. I'm sure we all work with people we think are over-paid. Does anybody here think Sir Philip Green is one of the great CEOs? Or Mark Zuckerberg is the most competent tech chief? What private companies pay their staff is their own business and has very little to do with how good they actually are at their job (especially when compared with other businesses/clubs.) Now if you're saying most Utd and Arsenal players are over-paid, I would agree. But that's very different from saying they deserve to win the league because they get paid the most.
Utd looked to get a bit lucky last night. I watched the goals show and they said Utd were the better side in the first half but ran out of ideas in the second. 90th minute Fellaini winner (from a lovely long ball and flick on, not that Utd fans will care). That's them and City in next round.
I do fear for Utd if they get a tough draw in the next round. Yes, it's not until Feb, but unless their performances improve massively they could end up being embarrassed.
On that note, Pool and Spuds both play tonight. Spuds have to win, and I do fancy them to nick it, but I suspect it will be academic as they will lose in Barcelona and Inter will beat PSV.
Pool have stuffed their group up rightly. A (deserved) last minute defeat in Napoli and a no show in Belgrade have left them in a precarious place. Win tonight and they are prob through, but PSG are no mugs. To quote some weird and **** 70's/80's film, "I hace a BAD feeling about this."
I do fear for Utd if they get a tough draw in the next round. Yes, it's not until Feb, but unless their performances improve massively they could end up being embarrassed.
On that note, Pool and Spuds both play tonight. Spuds have to win, and I do fancy them to nick it, but I suspect it will be academic as they will lose in Barcelona and Inter will beat PSV.
Pool have stuffed their group up rightly. A (deserved) last minute defeat in Napoli and a no show in Belgrade have left them in a precarious place. Win tonight and they are prob through, but PSG are no mugs. To quote some weird and **** 70's/80's film, "I hace a BAD feeling about this."
Yeah it's still all to play for in group C, but losing to PSG will certainly make it tougher to qualify. I hope Spurs win tonight as it would at least make the Barca game exciting, even though we're probably already out.
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Talking of being over paid the Real Madrid situation is a right mess. They are loosing money hand over fist and I can see huge problems on the horizon for them.
As for Man Utd fans thinking we are going to win the league in so many years because of our history, that's just delusional. You say we won the treble in 1999 and although that was our best ever season our history has been littered with success since and before, the history of the success should only be used as a tool to drive future players to succeed.
Look at clubs like Aston Villa, Nottingham Forest and Leeds Utd success comes and goes, once you loose that certain mentality your in trouble.
As for last nights match I don't see what all the fuss is about, Man Utd were poor, but it was Young Boys cup final and a Fergie time winner at Old Trafford AGAIN and all of a sudden that's a negative for all the pundits and media. Listening to all the reports on the Radio and TV how they said Man City have qualified with a game to spare and Man Utd scraped through with a last minute winner!!! We qualified with a game to spare out of a group with Juvetus and Valencia in, piss off! :lol: I hope we get a tough side in the next round it will bring the best out of the entire club and is a chance to change the feeling at Old Trafford. It's going to be a long winter though. :|
As for Man Utd fans thinking we are going to win the league in so many years because of our history, that's just delusional. You say we won the treble in 1999 and although that was our best ever season our history has been littered with success since and before, the history of the success should only be used as a tool to drive future players to succeed.
Look at clubs like Aston Villa, Nottingham Forest and Leeds Utd success comes and goes, once you loose that certain mentality your in trouble.
As for last nights match I don't see what all the fuss is about, Man Utd were poor, but it was Young Boys cup final and a Fergie time winner at Old Trafford AGAIN and all of a sudden that's a negative for all the pundits and media. Listening to all the reports on the Radio and TV how they said Man City have qualified with a game to spare and Man Utd scraped through with a last minute winner!!! We qualified with a game to spare out of a group with Juvetus and Valencia in, piss off! :lol: I hope we get a tough side in the next round it will bring the best out of the entire club and is a chance to change the feeling at Old Trafford. It's going to be a long winter though. :|
theforceuk said:
I've made no secret of my utter hatred for Real Madrid (and it long long pre dates last season's CL final), so I really do hope they implode. They are a despicable club. They tap up with impunity, UEFA really have one set of rules for the biggest clubs and another for everyone else. They are like magpies they collect shiny things ie flavour of the month players. They never seem to have any long term beyond buy lots of players at their peak and continue.
The sad truth is they will continue to do what they have done and the money will appear as it always has. Last time they were short of a few quid the local council bought their training ground for 200million Yoyo's and then gave it back to them. I can't remember the exact details (Google will tell you) but if it wasn't "given" to them is was sold back at something pathetic like 1 Euro. An utter disgrace. Financial doping and state aid if ever there was any. But I think it pre dated FFP (which is a farce anyway) so UEFA just casually glanced the other way.
theforceuk said:
The whole Utd thing is a classic case of 'is your glass half full, or half empty?"
Yes, they are through with a game to spare in what looked like quite a tough group. Glass half full. Well done.
BUT, they have been shite. They robbed Juve in Italy. A victory that was as deserved as their '99 CL final win (or Liverpool's in '05) and they scrapped past a piss poor Swiss side. They scored ONE goal in three home games FFS. Glass half empty. Massive room for improvement.
Just looking at who is through, there aren't that many big sides who are playing well. Real are, by their standards pretty poor. Barca are still a good side, but not AS good. Utd can't get Juve so we ignore them. Bayern are on the slide and have been for a few years. They are still a decent side but not a patch on what they were.
There is country protection so they can't get City, or Liverpool if Pool fluke winning their group. PSG/Napoli are solid enough but not superb. Ditto Atletico/Dortmund. Whoever wins group D will be the team every runner up wants.
So Utd (and Pool/Spuds if they come second) may actually be ok as a lot of the big European sides are in transition.
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The glass certainly is half full and has been evaporating since May 2013. :lol: I agree 'Real' Madrid will probably be ok in the end as the Spanish government look at the club as a heritage that needs preserving.
The Champions League is very open this season I agree and Man Utd really need a good run in it. :|
The Champions League is very open this season I agree and Man Utd really need a good run in it. :|
Good result for Spuds. I didn't see the game but a win is what they needed. I still fear it is too little too late. They won't win in Barca and Inter will beat PSV, but still, keeps it interesting.
Disappointing result from Pool. Not sure how Jurgen had them set up in the first half but by god did it NOT work. 2-1 at HT flattered them, massively. 3 or 4-0 would have been a fairer reflection. PSG didn't do a huge amount in the second half, but they didn't need to. Liverpool also managed to create the sum total of FA squared over 90 mins. Stephen Hawking (RIP) could have done nets for PSG and the score would have been the same.
Ohh and as for PSG's diving about and constant time wasting, should one of Europe's so called big clubs really be resorting to that at home in a group stage game? I know it's part of the game but it just struck me as a bit classless.
Not sure what's up with Pool in Europe this year. They have been very underwhelming. They aren't playing the same free flowing football they did last year. I don't know if that's cos Jurgen realised leaving yourself open at the back invited trouble or if it's just a phase (or was last season a fluke)? Either way I would NOT be putting money on them beating Napoli. EL it is, I suspect.
Disappointing result from Pool. Not sure how Jurgen had them set up in the first half but by god did it NOT work. 2-1 at HT flattered them, massively. 3 or 4-0 would have been a fairer reflection. PSG didn't do a huge amount in the second half, but they didn't need to. Liverpool also managed to create the sum total of FA squared over 90 mins. Stephen Hawking (RIP) could have done nets for PSG and the score would have been the same.
Ohh and as for PSG's diving about and constant time wasting, should one of Europe's so called big clubs really be resorting to that at home in a group stage game? I know it's part of the game but it just struck me as a bit classless.
Not sure what's up with Pool in Europe this year. They have been very underwhelming. They aren't playing the same free flowing football they did last year. I don't know if that's cos Jurgen realised leaving yourself open at the back invited trouble or if it's just a phase (or was last season a fluke)? Either way I would NOT be putting money on them beating Napoli. EL it is, I suspect.
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PSG were a joke last night I ended up turning over they were doing my head in so much. That Neymar wants a good smack if you ask me, he's an embarrassment to the male population. Haven't Barcelona already won the group? If so Spurs May have a chance and it's going to be a big Anfield European Cup night when they will bang in a last minute goal to send them through. :lol:
theforceuk said:
I'm glad it wasn't just me and my slightly Liverpool tinted specs.
theforceuk said:
I think so. Even a "weakened" Barca side will be too much for Spurs I fear.
Can't see it on Liverpool. This CL campaign just has that underwhelming feel to it. Almost as if last year used up all their luck and this year they come back to earth with a bump. I hope you're rite though.
Spurs need to match Inter's result against PSV in order to progress, so there is a smidgeon of hope. Much as I'd love them to beat Barca, that's a pretty tall order (although not completely impossible if we can replicate the form we showed against Chelsea). However a draw might be more achievable, so if PSV manage to hold Inter, Spurs could yet go through.
Richard_H
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Nobody can say we didn't deserve that. From the first few minutes we showed the steel and determination that's been missing for the last 8 or so years. Fully expected to go behind, our defence is woeful after all, but what was surprising was just how many Spurs players were totally anonymous in the second half.
I was driving this afternoon so missed it, but I know we were winning at half time so I can guess what Poch did - rather than try to hang on to the valuable lead and win the most important game of the season, he threw everyone forward and got embarrassed on the counter attack. THREE TIMES. Honestly, I respect the guy for what he's done, but he will never learn. We've lost too many important games from winning positions.
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