Resealed figure discovery debate - G.Kurtz Palitoy VC Jawa.

[Lafos]

Please check your Luke Farmboy! This is also a PBP (late) figure! I never saw one on a German card before! :O

Hi. My luck I did not buy this:

I noticed that the figure is cracked inside the bubble! I have to check who the seller was and what the history of this is.

Wolfgang

The blister was obiously attached the same the way as the highly discussed misbubbled Snowtrooper.

 

[Grant_C]

Do you think it might be worth compiling a list of what was bought from Toni by everyone?

This way we could look for details on specific figures and maybe green light others.

All mine are ESB 45b or ROTJ 45.

 

[kraftdermacht]

My palitoy fett has the red dot on the back next to Chewbacca

As I posted before. The red dot means nothing. I found at least 4 cards from stores that have it.

 

[kraftdermacht]

Wolfgang, do you have a GM 45 back (MOC or cardback) in possession with the english text on the back, that has a (german) PRICESTICKER affixed ?

As was already noted by Jason Palitoy ALL his loose cards and ALL my loose cards (and non Toni figures) do NOT have the English text on the back.

Points clearly to the theory that the cards with English text were rejected, put in storage and purchased later by someone.

 

[Captainsolo1978]

I have four Palitoy Carded figs from Toni.

German Esb Han Solo and Han Bespin.

ROTJ C3 PO and Luke Tatooine , both 45 backs.

All are en route to my new home so can't check them. I have moved overseas.

 

[kraftdermacht]

These are not from Toni:

Wolfgang

Hi Wolfgang, these are potentially the most useful items in this thread. Do any of the bubbles have the crescent shape or dimpled pin-sized holes?

I checked 23 of Toni's GM figures from the early 2000. Non have the crescent shape or dimpled pin-sized holes yet. BUT the FX7 I got in 2005. Suddenly Toni had this in stock! And this FX7 has the dimples! Seems back in 2000 they did not have a bubble for FX7. Mid 2000s they were able to produce good replica bubbles and the dimples and pin-sized holes came up.

All the early 2000s GM figures look quite perfect. Bubbles attached in a factory like process. Different bubbles means also different tooling needed. They are professionally made. Nothing like the Snowtrooper crap we have seen.

 

[edd_jedi]

I checked 23 of Toni's GM figures from the early 2000. Non have the crescent shape or dimpled pin-sized holes yet.

Do any of your double stemmed MOCs that are not from TT have the triangle shaped iron marks, usually seen between the double stem area?

 

[**Delboy75**]

That's quite a change in background colour between the Toni moc and the used card back.

 

[chiquetaba]

HI ALL.

THIS THREAD IS NOW EXTREMELY LONG AND NEARLY IMPOSSIBLE TO CATCH, WITHOUT MENTIONNING SIMILAR THREADS ON OTHER FORUMS.

IF WE WANT TO SPREAD THE WORD AND 'EDUCATE' THE COMMUNITY, I THINK WE SHOULD HAVE A BASIC THREAD, WITH NO REPLIES, PROVIDING :

- ALL THE ELEMENTS 'AT CHARGE' ALLOWING TO SPOT THOSE 'MODERN SEALS'

- THE (CONTINUOUSLY UPDATED) LIST OF CARDED FIGURES WITH BRAND/FRONT/BACK COMBINATIONS.

STEPHANE

 

[Lafos]

That's quite a change in background colour between the Toni moc and the used card back.

And different punchholes regarding position and shape !

 

[plantman]

HI ALL.

THIS THREAD IS NOW EXTREMELY LONG AND NEARLY IMPOSSIBLE TO CATCH, WITHOUT MENTIONNING SIMILAR THREADS ON OTHER FORUMS.

IF WE WANT TO SPREAD THE WORD AND 'EDUCATE' THE COMMUNITY, I THINK WE SHOULD HAVE A BASIC THREAD, WITH NO REPLIES, PROVIDING :

- ALL THE ELEMENTS 'AT CHARGE' ALLOWING TO SPOT THOSE 'MODERN SEALS'

- THE (CONTINUOUSLY UPDATED) LIST OF CARDED FIGURES WITH BRAND/FRONT/BACK COMBINATIONS.

STEPHANE

please check this thread: http://www.starwarsforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=18756

Thanks,

Andy

 

[Grant_C]

HI ALL.

THIS THREAD IS NOW EXTREMELY LONG AND NEARLY IMPOSSIBLE TO CATCH, WITHOUT MENTIONNING SIMILAR THREADS ON OTHER FORUMS.

IF WE WANT TO SPREAD THE WORD AND 'EDUCATE' THE COMMUNITY, I THINK WE SHOULD HAVE A BASIC THREAD, WITH NO REPLIES, PROVIDING :

- ALL THE ELEMENTS 'AT CHARGE' ALLOWING TO SPOT THOSE 'MODERN SEALS'

- THE (CONTINUOUSLY UPDATED) LIST OF CARDED FIGURES WITH BRAND/FRONT/BACK COMBINATIONS.

STEPHANE

This has been done Steph:

http://www.starwarsforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=18756

 

[mr_palitoy]

Lots of talk about what we call these.

Ladies and gents I give you the....

TOC - Toni On Card



Jason

 

[Pomse2001]

Lots of talk about what we call these.

Ladies and gents I give you the....

TOC - Toni On Card



Jason

Good Idea mate, wish he also could be on a TOC so he could not make more trouble with this TOC

 

[wbobafett]

Hey Wolfgang...I think the same dimples can be seen on Josh's Dengar??:

posted here:
http://forum.rebelscum.com/t1104900-33/

 

[PIGCITY]

Whatever the outcome 'mud sticks' unfortunately and a couple of peoples reputation will now forever be called into question, with their involvement in this sorry story.

On another note, I just popped into the Flea Market to see what MOC's were on sale, and in a 'certain' cabinet was the usual stuff a yellowed, creased Logray, Bib Fortuna & this Threepio. No waffle pattern, very bright unpunched, spotless card, no pink dot, no printing errors, and a very clear bubble. £50

 

[wbobafett]

RS thread from 2003:
http://forum.rebelscum.com/t809708/

....

Over a decade ago I truly 'struggled' to find the 'almost fabled' Palitoy RotJ 45 back of the 'Tri-logo' (light blue) Boba Fett...BUT now there are quite a few 'out there'!?!

There is a rumoured 'theory' that many of the remaining figures near the demise of Palitoy in the UK, were carded on to any surplus cardback going?! = The 'Tri-logo' Boba Fett variant certainly would 'fit the bill'! = I didn't originally see an example at retail until late 1984 / early '85?!? So how did it end up on the late 1982 / early '83 45 back?

= Palitoy had a Boba Fett on the Tri-logo card too!

Does anyone know where this 'glut' of European 45 backs actually/specifically came from???

Bill

...and:

Sure!...Not ALL German 45 backs are easy to find!

Far from it in fact! BUT just recently a LOT of 'case fresh' examples have been appearing?!

= Can anyone explain to me why?

ALL the Palitoy RotJ 45 back 'Tri-logo' Boba Fetts that have only recently appeared seem to be in near 'perfect' condition too?!

= Am I the only collector to find this a little 'odd'? + Does anyone have a 'worn' carded example below 'C8'???

Bill

And that is the same question 10 years later:

Has anyone ever seen a lightblue "trilogo" Fett on a worn ROTJ 45C or 65 back??

 

[Grant_C]

What details are needed for each MOC to generate a list?

01: Logo
02: Figure
03: Back
04: Bubble
05: Details of markings on offer

What else?

 

[wbobafett]

What details are needed for each MOC to generate a list?

01: Logo
02: Figure
03: Back
04: Bubble
05: Details of markings on offer

What else?

I can help with Coo as far as possible.

 

[Lafos]

The left cardback front is missing some stars obviously. Background colours are different.

The punchholes are different regarding shape & position.

 

[kraftdermacht]

I checked 23 of Toni's GM figures from the early 2000. Non have the crescent shape or dimpled pin-sized holes yet.

Do any of your double stemmed MOCs that are not from TT have the triangle shaped iron marks, usually seen between the double stem area?

Non of my double stemmed MOCs have triangle shaped iron marks. Not the ones from Toni (early 2000s purchases) and not the ones from other sources.

 

[olisuds]

So what, i dont get it.
You seem to think it is OK.
He is also reponsible for at least 500++++ of these being out ther now.

hi M4K3R1 i did not know there was anything untoward with the background of these figures when i sold them , i knew there was issue with the way some of them had been packaged but never really worried about it at the time and sold them at the same price a lose figures

so i did not do anything wrong , its no different then the collectors that have bought and sold these figures over the last 20 years they did not know like my self there was anything wrong with these figures ether .

i have not done anything that is underhand or wrong in any way.

i hope that clear this up for you

jason

Time for me to be the ******* that says what at least half of the people here are thinking right now..... Jason, when you bought the Fetts and Snowys you even have said that you knew the bubbles weren't "right" and you knew that the 25,000 other items were unsealed cardbacks and bubbles....... and DIDN'T think that there was something wrong with selling these figures that you had bought that the seals didn't seem right on?.. But you sold them along anyway....... You show up at a toy fair with some pieces that were supposedly from Toni, but are far worse than any of other things we've seen from him, after you'd claimed to have sold off everything else that could connect you to that situation...... It all seems a bit like a calculated revenge **** if you ask me. I'm past the point of thinking that Toni's 100% innocent of something wrong, but I'm definitely not convinced that you're being 100% honest either.

Cheers
Joe

Well said Joe.

Its threads like these that I wish there was a "like" button then I wouldn't have to trawl through a 100 pages just to find something of value to the discussion.

[
But were is the hard and concrete proof that TT is actually doing the sealling himself.
As for TT bying the U grade figures that match up to the type of figures TT is selling on sealed cards,
can you or anyone actually match a loose figure TT bought to one TT sold on a sealled card.
If you cant, then all you have is TT selling the post factory seals unknowinglly, just the same as you did.
Not questioning the the post factory sealed debate,
but the fact that you are still acusing him of doing the sealling himself,
with out the solid evidence need to prove this.

Hope you understand what i am trying to convey to you.
Regards.
Oscar.

I think this is a great point. People really should be paying more attention to matching his loose figures to the MOCs he is selling otherwise we'll have another 100 pages of circumstantial evidence to trawl through!

@Joe O: I said i was taking a break from this thread but I got a day "working" from home LOL

Although still not sure I can be bothered to make it to page 97.

 

[kraftdermacht]

The left cardback front is missing some stars obviously. Background colours are different.

The punchholes are different regarding shape & position.

What leads to the "rejected because of quality issues" theory would be more the very dark stripes cross the logo. I find these on several of my TT figures but not on my loose cards.

 

[olisuds]

Guys how do we know the factory didn't try and pump out the poor QC stuff at the end when they were about to close down or after they closed. And this could be the stuff Arthur or Toni picked up.

I've seen businesses close down and all sorts of stuff is sometimes salvaged for selling to make a last few bucks and reduce waste.

I think you are putting a lot of effort into this but have you really thought about what its going to achieve? More circumstantial evidence of which we already have nearly 100 pages.

 

[Grant_C]

I think all we will get is circumstantial.

Is it unusual or standard practice to have several combinations of one figure back?

 

[benny100]

The left cardback front is missing some stars obviously. Background colours are different.

The punchholes are different regarding shape & position.

Isn't the fx-7 facing the wrong way? Pretty much every one I've seen has the arm towards the left.

 

[itfciain]

Guys how do we know the factory didn't try and pump out the poor QC stuff at the end when they were about to close down or after they closed. And this could be the stuff Arthur or Toni picked up.

I've seen businesses close down and all sorts of stuff is sometimes salvaged for selling to make a last few bucks and reduce waste.

I think you are putting a lot of effort into this but have you really thought about what its going to achieve? More circumstantial evidence of which we already have nearly 100 pages.

Oli - I see your point about this been old stock but all this would go away if Toni posted up a picture of this 'stock' - he has had lots of chances to do this - and any reason not to (i.e. devaluing his stock) has gone out of the window as his reputation is now in tatters

 

[olisuds]

Toni isn't going to post a picture of his stock or anything else and Jason isn't going to post his list.

Another 100 pages of studying bubbles, seals and card QC issues isn't going to get us any further than we already are.

Sorry to be negative but I think this is spiraling out of control when we start analysing which direction FX-7s arm faces.

 

[itfciain]

Toni isn't going to post a picture of his stock or anything else

But why wouldn't you if it would put all this to bed?

I also think you are being a bit dismissive of people's efforts to try and find out what is going on - a lot of people have £100's if not £1000's tied up in all of this mess and are rightly worried

 

[plantman]

Toni being silent is all the proof i need personally but like Joe says if we can find one of his U grade figures mounted on a card that would be perfect.