Important info on Potential Toy Toni carded figure scam.

[_Lee_]

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/291258993058?_trksid=p2055359.m1431.l2648&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

Tony??? I only ask as it a 65 and the bubble is mighty long and the seal look suspect???

Just seen this cardback in a bunch i have buddy, hope this puts your mind at rest

 

[_Lee_]

Just adding this 'factual' evidence to this thread.

This is a Chewbacca 65 back card, with blacked out type on the back that was obtained from a childhood collection with loose figures and around 30-40 more cardbacks from other stores aswell. This card has a tescos label, and was definately shop bought back in the day.

I have added this as Iain was told his Chewbacca in his valuation thread was a TT when im sure it isnt.

 

[_Lee_]

Personally i dont think that anything linked to Toni with regards to Palitoy can be trusted 100%. I know he had crap loads of Kenner carded aswell, but those were legit. As far as Palitoy and GM,s cards go, it will forever be conjecture. Thats why i dont follow or beleive checklists that have been assembled since this all came out because in my eyes they are scaremongering and putting out incorrect information which is very dangerous.

I also beleive Toni had Palitoy logo unused cardbacks too, but again thats just my own opinion...

Sorry can I ask why you 'believe' Tony had unused Palitoy logo cardbacks? Do you have any evidence to support this?
I can understand how Tony got hold of Jedi cardbacks after the Palitoy factory closed in 1985. As we know there were a lot of Jedi produced compared to SW and Empire and what with that plus the life of SW toys sort of coming to an end at that time there was a lot of unsold factory/shop stock-hence why we c many Jedi pieces in fantastic condition today But surely during the SW and Empire era with the demand outweighing the supply I wouldn't have expected one to get hold of unused cardbacks :?

As said by other members I don't really think u can make statements without having any real evidence to back U up. I have been in the game getting on for 20 years and know a fair few serious Palitoy collectors but have never heard or seen anything to support your foul play beliefs regarding logo Palitoy MOCs :!:

Your statements may well cause ill deserved scaremongering :!:

Forgot to reply to this.

Sorry if it offends, but they are my thoughts and thats it. It may well seem like scaremongering but anything is possible, and quite a lot of information in this thread could be deemed as scaremongering whilst we are talking about the word. Inaccurate lists, strange 'fake' bubble theorys and also completely contradicting 'evidence' in some cases. Unless each of these unused cards has a tracker beacon on it, and one man holds the tracking locater i find it bloody amazing with some things said in this thread. If anyone beleives that the guy who started this farce with a comment said 10 months ago, hasnt played any part in this then they need their heads looking at. Does it not speak volumes that he rarely comes on anymore??? If he does, id like to see if he would admit to an after factory bubble sealing???

Again, sorry but its my own opinion and ill ask for the post to be deleted if it makes you feel any better.

 

[jules_p]

I know there be a lot of posts of the potential Toy Toni scam all over the place including on RS, it quite hard to find what you want . The evidence for most part is circumstantial I gather?

So I appreciate your inputs on the 2 stormies below - any concerns?

Cheers, Jules

 

[mr_palitoy]

I know there be a lot of posts of the potential Toy Toni scam all over the place including on RS, it quite hard to find what you want . The evidence for most part is circumstantial I gather?

So I appreciate your inputs on the 2 stormies below - any concerns?

Cheers, Jules

View attachment 2

View attachment 1

You haven't pictured the backs of the cards.

If the storm trooper is German then it's a Toni, if it's palitoy then it's ok.
If the snow trooper is a palitoy 65d then it's a Toni, if it's a palitoy 45c then it's ok.

Cheers Jason

 

[jules_p]

You haven't pictured the backs of the cards.

If the storm trooper is German then it's a Toni, if it's palitoy then it's ok.
If the snow trooper is a palitoy 65d then it's a Toni, if it's a palitoy 45c then it's ok.

Cheers Jason

Thanks for chipping in Jason.

the storm is German and snow is a 65d. So it is Toni, does it mean it is a fake or just suspect as I gather he sold some genuine as well? I haven't been following the forums when this first broke out and there too many posts all over too to read the relevant bits. Cheers, Jules

 

[mr_palitoy]

You haven't pictured the backs of the cards.

If the storm trooper is German then it's a Toni, if it's palitoy then it's ok.
If the snow trooper is a palitoy 65d then it's a Toni, if it's a palitoy 45c then it's ok.

Cheers Jason

Thanks for chipping in Jason.

the storm is German and snow is a 65d. So it is Toni, does it mean it is a fake or just suspect as I gather he sold some genuine as well? I haven't been following the forums when this first broke out and there too many posts all over too to read the relevant bits. Cheers, Jules

Those cards both look like Toni's to me. The genuine stuff he sold was Kenner and trilogo mostly.

Cheers Jason

 

[jules_p]

You haven't pictured the backs of the cards.

If the storm trooper is German then it's a Toni, if it's palitoy then it's ok.
If the snow trooper is a palitoy 65d then it's a Toni, if it's a palitoy 45c then it's ok.

Cheers Jason

Thanks for chipping in Jason.

the storm is German and snow is a 65d. So it is Toni, does it mean it is a fake or just suspect as I gather he sold some genuine as well? I haven't been following the forums when this first broke out and there too many posts all over too to read the relevant bits. Cheers, Jules

Those cards both look like Toni's to me. The genuine stuff he sold was Kenner and trilogo mostly.

Cheers Jason

I tried to read some of this thread and there a lot to digest. Dimbles was mentioned within. The Storm card photo seem to indicate dimbles (i need to dig him out to check). Does dimbles indicate anything?

 

[mr_palitoy]

You haven't pictured the backs of the cards.

If the storm trooper is German then it's a Toni, if it's palitoy then it's ok.
If the snow trooper is a palitoy 65d then it's a Toni, if it's a palitoy 45c then it's ok.

Cheers Jason

Thanks for chipping in Jason.

the storm is German and snow is a 65d. So it is Toni, does it mean it is a fake or just suspect as I gather he sold some genuine as well? I haven't been following the forums when this first broke out and there too many posts all over too to read the relevant bits. Cheers, Jules

Those cards both look like Toni's to me. The genuine stuff he sold was Kenner and trilogo mostly.

Cheers Jason

I tried to read some of this thread and there a lot to digest. Dimbles was mentioned within. The Storm card photo seem to indicate dimbles (i need to dig him out to check). Does dimbles indicate anything?

Yes, those dimples may mean it's okay. The video footage from the palitoy factory shows the pins to keep the bubble in place during the sealing process. For storm trooper Toni used the same bubble as the factory did. So I think you may be good on this card with those dimples being visible on the 2nd photo.

Cheers Jason

 

[spoons]

The Stormtrooper is identical to one I had and have since sold as I was convinced it was a Toni.

Took a fair hit on the sale, but the buyer has since flipped it as genuine - a murky world out there post Tonigate

Its interesting that both mine and this Stormtrooper have the dimpled bubbles. It would suggest he had preferred bubbles for certain figures/cards, or did them in batches or perhaps most controversially that they could be shop stock

 

[jules_p]

The Stormtrooper is identical to one I had and have since sold as I was convinced it was a Toni.

Took a fair hit on the sale, but the buyer has since flipped it as genuine - a murky world out there post Tonigate

Its interesting that both mine and this Stormtrooper have the dimpled bubbles. It would suggest he had preferred bubbles for certain figures/cards, or did them in batches or perhaps most controversially that they could be shop stock

I definitely believe that Toni has original stock as I used to visit the display stall in Brighton over several years - I believe this is Toni's? Among the various MOCs usually included Trilogos with dents, RoTJ with yellow bubbles, mecanno Jawas - some bubbles with slight yellowing - they definitely didn't look recently sealed or pampered with, as I examined many over the years . I actually brought the snow stormie from that stall for £35 a few years ago. I am thinking it hardly be worth Toni's time to fake and sell it at that price esp if a minty stormie can easily fletch £20-25 on fleabay. These stormies were always 100% mint and unplayed with.

I can see there are some serious concerns out there - the Trilogo fetts on the early cards seem very dodgy - perhaps there more to gain with high value items or something like that. It would help Toni himself a lot if he showed a few pics of his trade cases or similar to vertify his MOCs are genuine. I take it he silent on the issue now isn't he? That really doesn't help, perhaps for introverted people or similar, they retract into their shell and shut shop when the circus spot light is on them. But sometimes, it can get too much, especially like on RS, where some folk will simply not give up. If that not the case, then there may be something to hide or it appears that way?

 

[Dark Sith Lord]

The Stormtrooper is identical to one I had and have since sold as I was convinced it was a Toni.

I take it he silent on the issue now isn't he?

He has never been anything other than silent mate. Speaks volumes.

 

[jules_p]

Yes, those dimples may mean it's okay. The video footage from the palitoy factory shows the pins to keep the bubble in place during the sealing process. For storm trooper Toni used the same bubble as the factory did. So I think you may be good on this card with those dimples being visible on the 2nd photo.

Cheers Jason

I got the stormtrooper card out and had another look.

There a 3rd dimble between the bubble stems above L of Ltd.

I had another good look at the seal. It is definitely done under a uniform pressure all the seal area round implying a proper pressing kit such as they had in the factory. It is no amateur sealing job for sure.

Perhaps I am risking my neck here but I think this card is genuine :shock:

Just my humble opinion

Cheers Jules

 

[mr_palitoy]

Yes, those dimples may mean it's okay. The video footage from the palitoy factory shows the pins to keep the bubble in place during the sealing process. For storm trooper Toni used the same bubble as the factory did. So I think you may be good on this card with those dimples being visible on the 2nd photo.

Cheers Jason

I got the stormtrooper card out and had another look.

There a 3rd dimble between the bubble stems above L of Ltd.

I had another good look at the seal. It is definitely done under a uniform pressure all the seal area round implying a proper pressing kit such as they had in the factory. It is no amateur sealing job for sure.

Perhaps I am risking my neck here but I think this card is genuine :shock:

Just my humble opinion

Cheers Jules

Have looked at that factory footage again. Those pins are on the outside of the card to keep the card from moving, not on the bubble itself.
I think the dimples on the bubbles are there as part of the manufacturing process of the bubble or as the result of a tool used to hold the bubble
in place while being non factory sealed.

So I don't think they add anything either way.

Jason

 

[theforceuk]

What people think is erelevant. Hard facts are what counts and there hard to get hold of with this TT situation. :?:

 

[jules_p]

Have looked at that factory footage again. Those pins are on the outside of the card to keep the card from moving, not on the bubble itself.
I think the dimples on the bubbles are there as part of the manufacturing process of the bubble or as the result of a tool used to hold the bubble
in place while being non factory sealed.

So I don't think they add anything either way.

Jason

Hi Jason,

Would it be possible to link me to the video in case it is of a one or quality that I not seen.

Also note the stormie MOC got an uniform pressure indention around the seal area on the card all round the bubble - it does look like a factory press device or similar.

Cheers,

Jules

 

[mr_palitoy]

Have looked at that factory footage again. Those pins are on the outside of the card to keep the card from moving, not on the bubble itself.
I think the dimples on the bubbles are there as part of the manufacturing process of the bubble or as the result of a tool used to hold the bubble
in place while being non factory sealed.

So I don't think they add anything either way.

Jason

Hi Jason,

Would it be possible to link me to the video in case it is of a one or quality that I not seen.

Also note the stormie MOC got an uniform pressure indention around the seal area on the card all round the bubble - it does look like a factory press device or similar.

Cheers,

Jules

It's just the video link you have already seen:-

[youtube]eFEX1jvSFDo[/youtube]

Can you post a pic of the back of the card? Increased pressing/ident round the bubble on the back of the card is a sign of a factory seal too.

cheers Jason

 

[jules_p]

Have looked at that factory footage again. Those pins are on the outside of the card to keep the card from moving, not on the bubble itself.
I think the dimples on the bubbles are there as part of the manufacturing process of the bubble or as the result of a tool used to hold the bubble
in place while being non factory sealed.

So I don't think they add anything either way.

Jason

Hi Jason,

Would it be possible to link me to the video in case it is of a one or quality that I not seen.

Also note the stormie MOC got an uniform pressure indention around the seal area on the card all round the bubble - it does look like a factory press device or similar.

Cheers,

Jules

It's just the video link you have already seen:-

[youtube]eFEX1jvSFDo[/youtube]

Can you post a pic of the back of the card? Increased pressing/ident round the bubble on the back of the card is a sign of a factory seal too.

cheers Jason

Hello Jason,

I enclose some more pics of the front of the card as looking at the back is very faint - you need to move the card in the light reflection to see it - there a very slight bend where the seal is.

Points to include (From the photos):

there actually 5 dimbles - 2 extra on left side of card (don't know if you can see it?) sorry I missed the other two :?
- it is a uniform press all round the bubble.

- looking at the stems - you should be able to see a crease on each stem - to me it looks like it happened during the bubble pressing action.

I hope this helps?

Jules

 

[mr_palitoy]

A lot of my AFA 90 Tonis had those creases on the bubble corners so I don't think that helps the case to say this is genuine.

Jason

 

[wasp]

Hello,

Could be a very similar figure?. The link is an AFA graduate Stormtrooper, and looks identical to the one shown here jules_p:

http://forum.rebelscum.com/t1114934/

Cheers.