Will the UK leave the EU ?

[Pomse2001]

What do you guys think, will the UK leave the EU on 23 June 2016 ?

 

[itfciain]

No,but all the racist xenophobes will get a chance to have their voice heard for a few months

The EU itself is a poorly run, self-serving organisation that gives barely elected individuals too much power, but the negative effect on the UKs economy from withdrawal will be much worse and people will see sense

Getting Boris onside is a major coup for them (he is obviously doing it with an eye on becoming next PM) - but the likes of Farage, Gallowway, Gove and IDS are awful bedfellows and I think the press on the whole are against withdrawal so will have much more influence

 

[kingshearer]

What do you guys think, will the UK leave the EU on 23 June 2016 ?

I hope we vote to leave since I've seen no improvements or opportunities for working class folk like myself.
Instead there's been a steady influx of economic immigrants which has meant increased unemployment, lack of housing, strains on the NHS (although I think that has more to do with there being far too many pen pushers) and wage freezes.

 

[edd_jedi]

I hope we vote to leave since I've seen no improvements or opportunities for working class folk like myself.
Instead there's been a steady influx of economic immigrants which has meant increased unemployment, lack of housing, strains on the NHS (although I think that has more to do with there being far too many pen pushers) and wage freezes.

Part of me would love to see Britain leave the EU and kick out all "immigrants" just to prove the lazy people who think "foreigners are stealing our jobs" wrong. Our own layabouts are far more of a strain on the country than migrants are. For every foreigner on benefits, there are a thousand working and paying tax, so the argument really doesn't stack up I'm afraid. And there is no shortage of work if you look for it.

 

[kingshearer]

I hope we vote to leave since I've seen no improvements or opportunities for working class folk like myself.
Instead there's been a steady influx of economic immigrants which has meant increased unemployment, lack of housing, strains on the NHS (although I think that has more to do with there being far too many pen pushers) and wage freezes.

Part of me would love to see Britain leave the EU and kick out all "immigrants" just to prove the lazy people who think "foreigners are stealing our jobs" wrong. Our own layabouts are far more of a strain on the country than migrants are. For every foreigner on benefits, there are a thousand working and paying tax, so the argument really doesn't stack up I'm afraid. And there is no shortage of work if you look for it.

I think it does stack up, cheap foreign workers, lack of housing due mainly to the priority system ( and the selling off of council houses by the iron lady) and the increased strain on the NHS. I agree with you about jobs being about but not up in the north east and why should someone say in Teeside leave his family for the week and work down in London for £10 an hour. I was out of work 2 years ago and when I was going to sign on these were the sort of suggestions being made. We need to get out of the EU and sort out our own Island and that includes possible regional devolution and decentralising power away from Westminster.

 

[edd_jedi]

Unfortunately people have to take some responsibility for their own future. Leaving the EU isn't going to open all the coal mines and car factories again - times have changed, and this "working class" mentality isn't going to get people anywhere. I see so many people who think a change in government will change their circumstances and magically solve all their problems, apparently oblivious to the fact they can do something about it themselves right now.

I'd love to live in the countryside and pick strawberries for a living, but I know that doesn't pay the bills which is why I moved to the south east (away from my family) to work in London. This idea that you can live and die in the same village your entire life is quite frankly out dated and never going to return. If people from Eastern Europe are willing to leave their country to find a job in the UK, I don't have a great deal of sympathy for people in the UK refusing to travel or relocate a couple of hundred miles to feed their families.

 

[lejackal]

Yay, politics, immigration and unemployment! This should be fun.

I'm pro Europe to be honest, I think the economic gains far outweigh "Johan foreigner coming over here and stealing our jobs"

:!: Sweeping generalisation ahead :!:

Migrant workers tend to have a better work ethic and unlike a lot of Brits they don't expect to earn £££ for this much effort

People of all nationalities take the piss with benefits, cash in hand work and pretty much everything else.

I do think the NHS needs a massive shake up as simply put there is not enough money going in one end for the services going out the other.
Should we scrap NI? No, we need some way to contribute to the welfare safety net and a revised NHS.
Should there be an expectation that we should pay for health insurance? Probably, although the elderly, children and A&E as well as antenatal care should probably be included in the NHS.

How would all this work? No idea but it sounds reasonable.

I think thats enough kindling to be going on with.........

 

[Mr-shifter]

Going away from the main topic of conversation slightly, I do hope this referendum will see the end of ukip, since whichever way the public vote, it sort of makes ukip a done issue.

I have never been very comfortable with having such a far right party in the uk that seems to be palatable and almost in the opinion of some a reasonable alternative option. I know the issue of Scottish independence didn't go away after the vote but only because it was so tight.

That is all.

 

[Grant_C]

I'm massivily pro-Europe.

I agree that the North of England has suffered high unemployment and decline, but feel that has more to do with centralised industry in London than the EU, replacing old industry with Hi-tech.

I lived in Germany/Austria for 6 months. Their trains were cheap and on time, everytime.

I class myself as a Welsh, British, European, Globalist.

There are also more UK citizens living abroad than immigrants in the UK, but i can understand why people are fearful of immigration.

 

[kingshearer]

I just get the feeling that Shameron just wants to stay in EU to keep his big business buddies happy and ensure London remains a big player.
I love voting against him.
I think regional devolution is the way forward, and the europe argument just gets in the way.
And the annoying phrase 'Northern powerhouse' should be called the 'Yorkshire Lancashire railway'.

 

[Grant_C]

I agree with devolution, but i would like to see it from the EU down, rather than London.

Be an interesting debate when the cases are brought forward.

 

[kingshearer]

I agree that the North of England has suffered high unemployment and decline, but feel that has more to do with centralised industry in London than the EU, replacing old industry with Hi-tech.

Concur, that's why we need de-centralisation or devolution but it would never happen.

 

[kingshearer]

I agree with devolution, but i would like to see it from the EU down, rather than London.

Be an interesting debate when the cases are brought forward.

Surely Europe down devolution would take even longer if at all.

 

[Cymonguk]

The biggest issue was that our industries declined during the 70s and 80s when we were competing against Taiwan, and the old east nations who could whip us on wage costs. That had nothing to do with anything that Labour or Conservatives did, it was a fact of the economic change that abounded. The way that Labour fought back against this was to shift a lot of our economy to financial services. This of course worked for a long time as the banks were effectively allowed to do what the hell they liked. When the banking system had a meltdown because of this we were left with little to no economic power, that is why things are a mess.

In terms of moving to where you can find work I think that is way easier said than done nowadays, if as a northerner I wanted to go move to the south east housing costs would make it virtually impossible. On the other hand I live in the countryside and travel two hours, each way, to work every day as a short term contractor, so I earn my money hard!

On the point of Europe I am broadly pro, I dont think leaving will do us any good nowadays. Economic trade would be much harder and those deals we have would be harder to negotiate. Personally I would stay in, coming out will save us very little overall.

 

[spoons]

Part of me would love to see Britain leave the EU and kick out all "immigrants" just to prove the lazy people who think "foreigners are stealing our jobs" wrong. Our own layabouts are far more of a strain on the country than migrants are.

Don't often chip in to these politics threads but Edd sums it up nicely - you could also add if the big corporations paid their taxes we could all afford to be layabouts

I also expected a far more mixed bag of views on here but we seem to be very much a pro-Europe bunch so far - must be because of all those Meccano, Harbert and Clipper cardbacks we want :mrgreen:

Back on track Cymon makes a very good point - having moved north 5 years ago I don't think I could afford to go back to the SE now

In terms of moving to where you can find work I think that is way easier said than done nowadays, if as a northerner I wanted to go move to the south east housing costs would make it virtually impossible

 

[jedisearcher]

On the news last night they were interviewing a Polish guy who had achieved British citizenship recently. They asked if more "foreigners", should be allowed into the country, and he said No! Talk about an "I'm all right Jack" mentality :lol:

There's not much doubt parts of the UK benefitted significantly in the late 20th century from European funding, but when you consider that the financial accounts of the EU haven't been signed off by the auditors for the past 18 years it really makes you wonder what a mess the organisation must be in, never mind all the political ire.

My only real concern is that we'd presumably get shafted for import duties from European purchases, like we are for the States now. Not the biggest factor to make an informed decision, but something to consider.

 

[theforceuk]

Probably as we will get offered a good deal to go back in at some point in the future.

I don't think we should leave though.

 

[Grant_C]

I think it's a step in the right direction. Do we think that Great Britain or the concept in nation state will last in 100 years?

Aren't Vulcans meant to emancipate us from binds of religion and nationalism?

Andy- brilliant. I'm proeurope because I collect Poch and Mecannos. :lol:

 

[edd_jedi]

I think it's a step in the right direction. Do we think that Great Britain or the concept in nation state will last in 100 years?

That's exactly the way I see it - people moaning about immigration, lack of UK industry etc are just stuck in the past. Leaving the EU isn't going to take us back to the Industrial Revolution. Great Britain has a fantastic history, but it is just that - history. We are no longer a major power, due to our size we'll never again be as powerful as the likes of America, Russia, China etc. People need to adapt to modern life rather than get British Bull Dog tattoos and blame everything on foreigners.

 

[Section 8]

The fact that immigration is top of the agenda on the in / out debate sickens me. It's been proven time after time that immigration benefits the UK massively.

Who is to say migration will go down if we do leave the EU? We will still need unskilled / skilled workers and doctors. We will still have asylum seekers and have to deal with those from Syria etc. Immigration will only stop with a policy change which will have to be made by the government who despite speaking of controlling our borders, are pro immigration due to the fact that they know the economic benefits it bring us and UK businesses. A large percentage of migrants don't even come from the EU so these numbers will not be affected if we leave or not. To think all of a sudden an immigration wall will be put up is naive.

People not being able to find a job up north is hardly something new so who's fault was it when there was no EU open door migration policy?

There as many Brits claiming benefits abroad than there are foreigners claiming benefits here. We have a million british pensioners "clogging up" the Spanish health service. Are we so stuck up, selfish and self centred that we should be given special treatment living abroad that foreigners shouldn't get on our soil.

The UK can sort out it's job and housing problems whether we are in or out of the EU. Unemployment was at it's lowest for decades under labour when immigration was at it's highest. This shows the lack of jobs to **** all to do with immigration. Our problems are due to a poorly run country and not those who enter it.

There are hundreds of small regulations and laws that we never hear about that won't affect you massively but are all there for our benefit. Human rights laws, food safety, renewable energy and pollution restrictions to name a few.

Time we grew up and started talking about the real benefits & real cons and ignoring the right wing racist mantra coming from UKIP and the press. If they can show some legitimate facts and statistics that can prove coming out of the EU will benefit us economically and improve our country and standard of living as a whole (including immigrants) then I'm all ears.

I won't hold my breath.