Resealed figure discovery debate - G.Kurtz Palitoy VC Jawa.

[Hothrebel]

Also I think Jeff Bass used to come over with loads of tri logos and German ESb carded figures in the early 90s ,I bought a load at Harrogate toy fair. Ah the good old days

 

[ace]

Didn't Toni from toy Toni get the German figures? He had a hell of a lot in the early 90s

thats correct they came from Arthur Bailie he bought around 25,000 figures bubbles and cards i was in on the deal and tried to buy the lot of Arthur but lost out to Toni , i think Toni bought them for around £10K , i know at one point Arthur was trying to buy figures as he had cards but no figures to put on them , what i really wanted was a set of the cards unused for myself but that never happened, i used to see Toni place ads in model mart though out the 90s and early 2000s selling these figures, he said to me once that he had found a way t heat the bubbles and attach them to the cards in the same way they did at the factory i think he may have even gone to a factory to have them put on the cards, i have never really gone for these German cards as i felt they were not relay finished figures, somewhere have a complete brake down of all the cards , there was also around 2000 carded figures that came in at the same time as Arthur bought the cards , i bought 500 carded hoth troopers on ROTJ cards and also around 700 Boba fett figures on ROTJ cards also , i sold the 700 to Crage Steven's a collator in Romford who when he got them opened them all that was around 1988 ish i think ? anyway there you go some more history

 

[ace]

Also I think Jeff Bass used to come over with loads of tri logos and German ESb carded figures in the early 90s ,I bought a load at Harrogate toy fair. Ah the good old days

i saw Jeff for the first time in 4 years last month at FACT in belgum , he is well and has a famaly now all blond he is such a nice guy a real toy fan , he has a great shop caled a spaceoddaty in holland the last one of us to still have shops , i owned 4 at one time off world , anyway Jeff is a lovly guy and helped me get my clipper set of figures.

thats the trick back then , find soemone like Jeff in Holland tell him you will pau him 25% above what he gets fro the stuff in his shop and leave hi to buy it in from other colelctors , i used to do that with one person in each country , if you ask more than one then you end up having to our bid your self , so i only worked with the one guy in each country and that really worked over a two year period you would ned up with most thing you wanted , and if there was one to two items you needed then make a play to get them out of someone's collation sometimes if it was the last thing i needed i did not really care what the going rate was , so if it was the last clipper figure i needed and it was going for say now days £600 then i would go and offer £1200 ? most people though i was off my head and sold it thinking they could find another one one day , i just wanted it and once i had it that was it i moved on to the next item on my list now my UK list is very small and i do not spend to much on toys anymore just the endless collecting of props when they turn up .

so jeff cool guy

jason

 

[ace]

Also I think Jeff Bass used to come over with loads of tri logos and German ESb carded figures in the early 90s ,I bought a load at Harrogate toy fair. Ah the good old days

i only did Harrogate the once , i remember selling some boxed 12 dolls there and a big item to a collator i think it was a cantina adventure set , rare in the UK back then , think i got £250 ? or maybe £275 ? was that to you ? funny if it was , anyway only went the once as it was a bit of a cow shad and it was a long way travel from london for a one day show .

i think i bought a shop display of stickers that day also its funny what comes back when you think about it,

and that was just the place to buy up some yaks to take to the US

yep good old days

j

 

[michifromhell]

So do you have a complete Set of Clipper Star Wars and ESB Figures? Would you share a pic from them ?

 

[theslider]

The photos are on the last page. :wink:

Seen that now Maulster - should've carried on reading before posting!

 

[ace]

So do you have a complete Set of Clipper Star Wars and ESB Figures? Would you share a pic from them ?

if my memory serves i did complete the 12 backs and i know i had maybe 50% of the ESB ones also , i never whet for just cards only un open figures and as i say back before ebay it was hard finding that stuff

as to taking photos of all this stuff i would love to do that for you all but i have a little brake right now in my business as i run event and do not have one till March , so now i just book guests for the coming year and little else for the next 10 days or so, so i have decided to spend a little time on here and find out how out of touch i am and i am way out of touch but its fun , anyway i will not have time to dig them out soon as i do own around 500,000 items now and its safe and in good staking boxes but it takes time to find anything , so i will do something soon so some of you can see some of the stuff , i am thinking of a public display at one of my events maybe in the next 12 months so let me have a think about that over the next month or so , ok

sorry i cannot just pull that stuff out quirky mate

goot to chat

jason

 

[mr_palitoy]

Didn't Toni from toy Toni get the German figures? He had a hell of a lot in the early 90s

thats correct they came from Arthur Bailie he bought around 25,000 figures bubbles and cards i was in on the deal and tried to buy the lot of Arthur but lost out to Toni , i think Toni bought them for around £10K , i know at one point Arthur was trying to buy figures as he had cards but no figures to put on them , what i really wanted was a set of the cards unused for myself but that never happened, i used to see Toni place ads in model mart though out the 90s and early 2000s selling these figures, he said to me once that he had found a way t heat the bubbles and attach them to the cards in the same way they did at the factory i think he may have even gone to a factory to have them put on the cards, i have never really gone for these German cards as i felt they were not relay finished figures, somewhere have a complete brake down of all the cards , there was also around 2000 carded figures that came in at the same time as Arthur bought the cards , i bought 500 carded hoth troopers on ROTJ cards and also around 700 Boba fett figures on ROTJ cards also , i sold the 700 to Crage Steven's a collator in Romford who when he got them opened them all that was around 1988 ish i think ? anyway there you go some more history

Sounds like Toy Toni still has a lot of carded figures still to sell then. So are the German cards he is still selling ones which were assembled in the 90's? That would
be quite a revelation. Many of those have been AFA graded subsequently so AFA think they are legitimately sealed. He also has a lot of case fresh Palitoy MOC. Were
any of those assembled?

There are still loads of hoth troopers/bob fetts kicking about so not all of them were opened.

:shock:

Jason

 

[JuniorChubb]

he said to me once that he had found a way t heat the bubbles and attach them to the cards in the same way they did at the factory i think he may have even gone to a factory to have them put on the cards

Sounds like Toy Toni still has a lot of carded figures still to sell then. So are the German cards he is still selling ones which were assembled in the 90's? That would
be quite a revelation. Many of those have been AFA graded subsequently so AFA think they are legitimately sealed. He also has a lot of case fresh Palitoy MOC. Were
any of those assembled?

:shock:

Jason

:shock: My thoughts too Jason.

 

[ace]

Sounds like Toy Toni still has a lot of carded figures still to sell then. So are the German cards he is still selling ones which were assembled in the 90's? That would
be quite a revelation. Many of those have been AFA graded subsequently so AFA think they are legitimately sealed. He also has a lot of case fresh Palitoy MOC. Were
any of those assembled?

There are still loads of hoth troopers/bob fetts kicking about so not all of them were opened.

:shock:

Jason

yes they were not just German carded ESB there was only around 10 to 15 different German cards the rest was a mixture, there was Palitoy ROTJ cards Fett were that i think i know all the ones i sold on the 700 were all opened but that dose not mean Toni did not get more from Arthur.

i know Toni paid good money for some mint figures in the 90s and i know Leia white was something he needed all the time ? hope that info is of use , i thought people knew they had been put together latter on ?

 

[mr_palitoy]

Sounds like Toy Toni still has a lot of carded figures still to sell then. So are the German cards he is still selling ones which were assembled in the 90's? That would
be quite a revelation. Many of those have been AFA graded subsequently so AFA think they are legitimately sealed. He also has a lot of case fresh Palitoy MOC. Were
any of those assembled?

There are still loads of hoth troopers/bob fetts kicking about so not all of them were opened.

:shock:

Jason

yes they were not just German carded ESB there was only around 10 to 15 different German cards the rest was a mixture, there was Palitoy ROTJ cards Fett were that i think i know all the ones i sold on the 700 were all opened but that dose not mean Toni did not get more from Arthur.

i know Toni paid good money for some mint figures in the 90s and i know Leia white was something he needed all the time ? hope that info is of use , i thought people knew they had been put together latter on ?

News to me and many others who have bought from Toy Toni!



Jason

 

[JuniorChubb]

News to a few people... :?

Can I ask for clarification here....

So these MOC's were put together after the runs had finished with unused bubbles and cards and 'minty' figures?

Mostly German cards but a good few Palitoy Jedi cards?

Impossible to tell the difference?

Did the game just change or is someone yanking our chains or maybe a misinterpretation?

 

[ace]

Sounds like Toy Toni still has a lot of carded figures still to sell then. So are the German cards he is still selling ones which were assembled in the 90's? That would
be quite a revelation. Many of those have been AFA graded subsequently so AFA think they are legitimately sealed. He also has a lot of case fresh Palitoy MOC. Were
any of those assembled?

There are still loads of hoth troopers/bob fetts kicking about so not all of them were opened.

:shock:

Jason

yes they were not just German carded ESB there was only around 10 to 15 different German cards the rest was a mixture, there was Palitoy ROTJ cards Fett were that i think i know all the ones i sold on the 700 were all opened but that dose not mean Toni did not get more from Arthur.

i know Toni paid good money for some mint figures in the 90s and i know Leia white was something he needed all the time ? hope that info is of use , i thought people knew they had been put together latter on ?

News to me and many others who have bought from Toy Toni!



Jason

well ask toni did he buy the figure from Arthur Bailey from Peterburough in the 90s , he did and he may not want to say that 25,000 cards and figures were not put together but its the truth , hay ask him about Arthur thats where they came from Arthur was a toy dealer that collated juke boxes and tin robots fro robots he was at one time the main man , Toni collect tin toys also and used to triad a lot between Arthur and him , Toni also had a lot of mint sealed transformers that cam from Arthur and i think he used to have quite a few herts modelled Daleks from the 70s and he used to slip them out once every 6 months or so as he dud not want to flood the market , these guys have been toy traders for longer than me i did not start till 1983 these guys were there in the late 70s i think , Tonl lived in Briton i think back then , anyway if you need anything more just ask , somewhere i have the complete list of all the cards figures and carded figures that was up for sale back then but i have moved house around 5 times sins then so its going to be in very old business files , its not something i would have thrown away as it was interesting at the time and i would have kept it as history but it will be hard to find quickly but i do have it somewhere, did not think that would be a big thing thought everyone knew ? jason

 

[ace]

somewhere i also have old model marts with ads in there from Toni that will tell you what carded figures he was selling.

 

[Hothrebel]

I think I may have stirred up a hornets nest here,I was aware of all this back in the early 90s I thought the whole thing was common knowledge,it certainly was back then.

 

[Hothrebel]

I am pretty new to this forum thing but I remember buying stuff off you (Jason) it was when you used to do the fairs with Mark (Woolard) I also bought a few things mail order from you through off world,I think it was the one in Romford.

 

[JuniorChubb]

I think I may have stirred up a hornets nest here,I was aware of all this back in the early 90s I thought the whole thing was common knowledge,it certainly was back then.

Being a post millenium collector this is all news to me...

How common is this knowledge?

 

[Grant_C]

I didn't know this. :?

 

[JuniorChubb]

Well, we've still got each other Grant.

The amount of questions this throws up is mind boggling. I feel a bit funny, a disturbance as if.....

 

[Hothrebel]

I suppose you have to remember this was all going on over 20 years ago,I think the vintage Star Wars collecting community was a lot smaller ,no ebay ,not a great deal going on on the internet,you had to actually deal with people face to face or at least talk to people over the phone,alot of the big players back then have disappeared ,I know a lot of people I used to buy from and deal with especially at the toy fairs have disappeared or aren't involved in the hobby any more,I always use to keep myself to myself back then.

 

[Grant_C]

Except for VC Jawas on British cards its been well to quite recently.

No bans, tits....this is much needed for that post count. :lol:

 

[mr_palitoy]

I think I may have stirred up a hornets nest here,I was aware of all this back in the early 90s I thought the whole thing was common knowledge,it certainly was back then.

Sounds like some old time collectors were aware. Certainly not many new collectors are.

Toni's stuff is all case fresh and many have been AFA graded before he sells them or afterwards.

If AFA can't tell they were sealed in the 90's as opposed to the 80's, then they are indistinguishable from the real thing.

So what impact does that have?

:?:

Jason

 

[JuniorChubb]

Except for VC Jawas on British cards its been well to quite recently.

No bans, tits....this is much needed for that post count. :lol:

We have got the banned thread for banning.

The Latest acquisitions for increasing your post count

And the links to RS threads for tits.

Do we really need this? I think I preferred the quiet...

 

[Hothrebel]

You are quite right ,I have always been more than happy with everything I bought off Toni,probably 50+ carded figures over the years

 

[Grant_C]

Except for VC Jawas on British cards its been well to quite recently.

No bans, tits....this is much needed for that post count. :lol:

We have got the banned thread for banning.

The Latest acquisitions for increasing your post count

And the links to RS threads for tits.

Do we really need this? I think I preferred the quiet...

So funny. :lol:

 

[itfciain]

Hmm this thread has definitely taken an interesting turn. Toni is a member on here, perhaps he would like to put his side of the story over?

 

[ace]

Hmm this thread has definitely taken an interesting turn. Toni is a member on here, perhaps he would like to put his side of the story over?

thats cool he knows me and he knows i know what happened back then and he knows i was also trying to buy the stock from Arthur and i do have a printed out list that i got from Arthur , it was common nonage back then i agree.

they are mint cards and people has a choice of not having the figures on card or buying what Toni had , most felt that they were original figures and original cards and bubbles just they had been put on much latter and not by Palitoy ?

if Toni is on here i think he will agree that this is what happened back then i am not the only one and i know many dealers back then that know this also .

jason

 

[ace]

i did have a little dig around in the only history file i have at the house and found this from a year 2000 copy of model mart

This was the first time ever a full set of Palitoy figures was put up for auction.

i thought it was the best way to offer everyone a chance to get what they wanted out of the set and to get the best price for my company , in these days you just sold things and they had a price this was something new back then.

none of this was on line you had to phone in or send a letter in with your bid , we had phone bids till 12 am and then the last offer was taken and if no one put another offer in fro 10 minuets then it was sold , the Luke and the Liea went on being bid on till 1 am if i remember it right. the old way of doing it

 

[_Lee_]

I find it ******* ironic, that some of the very people who are quick to shoot Jason down are more than happy to celebrate a good time at his conventions. The conventions that actually give to the star wars community by having access to cast and crew some of which I have no idea where in the film. Yet the same people are quick to defend ugrading pricks who are actually destroying the future of the hobby and causing prices to go up.

Havent posted here in ages,but didnt want to turn away from this dig at me

Ok Grant,i know that was a dig at me.Yes,i go to shows run by Jason,but i go to further my collection and meet friends.I dont do it to line his pockets.Seriously,you are still beating the u-grade defending people horse??? such a shame you were not tough enough to meet up with Robbie at CE2.He did mention you done a good job of hiding.Robbie is a good friend of mine,and ill defend him as you defend people here.I defend him as that,a friend and not as a ugrader.

If this is Jason,ive seen your collection in the flesh.Can you remind me where it was on display again??? back in 2000 if i remember correcty (id like Jason/ace to answer that-i know where it was displayed) do have the original advertising poster somewhere.

Also,the Offworld stores you had donea great job in ripping people off.My mother came to you looking for an xmas present for me and either you,or one of those twats who worked for you sold her a sneak preview Mace Windu for about 10 tmes more than it was worth and told her it was limited to 500 worldwide.

There was also an article in a local paper where i live,which stated your store had been caught selling fake props-remember? There were numerous props,not onlySW either

Oh,and BTW im pretty confident that the cards theory is true.I have known of that for a long time,but kept quiet.Ive even heard rumours lately,that many,many Palitoy ROTJ figures were
made as recently as early 2000.So,this can of worms is now well and truly opened.I heard this from 2 reliable sources...

Brown nose sandperson??? WTF???

Grant,if you would like to pm me to discuss please feel free to.Im not looking for a verbal slanging match,just dont like being pointed at.

 

[_Lee_]

Also,you guys think the guywho apparently has the largest collection in the world doesnt know what U-grading is???seriously???