Long Time suspected FAKE baggies scam / seller

[Ross_Barr]

I wonder if the investigation will prove better discussed on the forums or on Facebook? Topical.

Know your question was tongue in cheek, Grant (or at least I think it was), but we discussed this privately before Frank went public (I was included on the pre-discussion to help the guys with the legal view on this potential fraud on the hobby). My personal view and I think those of the others was that it would do the hobby a great disservice if this was discussed in multiple thread across many FB groups and forums.

For that reason, hopefully admins in various FB groups will post links to this thread to let their members know about the issue, but direct them to this forum thread to discuss the issue so that it is all here.

 

[plantainman]

Very disappointing. I imagine many buyers have paid 'that premium' thinking they are buying from a trusted seller and it turns out maybe they're being duped into buying fakes? So very sad if it turns out this seller has been defrauding folk for years.

I think we need to start a new sticky thread tracking the 'going rate' of integrity instead of loose figure prices!!

 

[maxf]

Frank- you should contact Jeff before releasing this in my opinion......

I've got to agree. The evidence is fairly damning, but you need to at least speak to him before you hand out the pitchforks to the baying mob.

 

[tiefighterboy]

I just used an ink stamper I had lying around on a plastic bag, just to see what it does. Scary.

 

[spoons]

Good work in outing these Frank but very depressing. The scary thing is what other fakes are out there and yet to be discovered.

I'd be happy if Jeff could clear his name, he did seem like a nice guy at FF. Unfortunately the hobby has had too many nice guys that wanted to make a fast buck, I hope Jeff is not one of them.

 

[wrighty]

I wonder if the investigation will prove better discussed on the forums or on Facebook? Topical.

Know your question was tongue in cheek, Grant (or at least I think it was), but we discussed this privately before Frank went public (I was included on the pre-discussion to help the guys with the legal view on this potential fraud on the hobby). My personal view and I think those of the others was that it would do the hobby a great disservice if this was discussed in multiple thread across many FB groups and forums.

For that reason, hopefully admins in various FB groups will post links to this thread to let their members know about the issue, but direct them to this forum thread to discuss the issue so that it is all here.

Once this is posted or link from FB there is no way to stop people discussing and commenting on the thread hence starting multiple discussions, unless admin block comments on the link - is that possible?

 

[xbomber]

I'd normally suggest this thread be removed and confirmed offline from both perspectives... but 140+ users plus scores of guests tells me this dirty linen is going to be washed in public.

 

[Bramistuta25]

Whilst I do agree that this should have been made public I also tend to agree that Jeff should have been approached first to make him aware that if he didn't give good explanation or reason for the amount of "suspected" fake baggies passing through his hands then it would in fact be made public.

I understand that a lot of time and effort would and probably has gone into this before making it public and whilst the evidence seems damning that they are at least passing through his hands and that a collector/trader of his knowledge should be able to see they are fake or ask an expert such as Frank, he still deserves the opportunity to explain.

Unfortunately that option is now unavailable.

Hopefully there is a plausible explanation for what is and has been happening but from experience both in the past and current it does seem unlikely.

My problem is that I like to believe the good in everyone and unfortunately it's not always the case.

 

[Frunkstar]

At the request of the photographer who took the images at FF of the stall & Jeff I have had to remove those images & his name from the post, as they are not my images but were posted in the investigations group, I have no choice but to grant that request & as such they have been removed.

I have sent Jeff an email with a link to this in hopes he will come on & clear this up if it is a simple case he is also the victim of a fraud on a large scale??

 

[Ross_Barr]

I wonder if the investigation will prove better discussed on the forums or on Facebook? Topical.

Know your question was tongue in cheek, Grant (or at least I think it was), but we discussed this privately before Frank went public (I was included on the pre-discussion to help the guys with the legal view on this potential fraud on the hobby). My personal view and I think those of the others was that it would do the hobby a great disservice if this was discussed in multiple thread across many FB groups and forums.

For that reason, hopefully admins in various FB groups will post links to this thread to let their members know about the issue, but direct them to this forum thread to discuss the issue so that it is all here.

Once this is posted or link from FB there is no way to stop people discussing and commenting on the thread hence starting multiple discussions, unless admin block comments on the link - is that possible?

Admins have multiple options to prevent that. They can delete any comments on the thread in FB or actually turn off commenting on the thread, opening it up only to bump it themselves and then turn commenting back off.

IMO this is what all admins in all groups should be doing on their threads about this. Directing folks to this forum and this thread.

 

[maxf]

I have sent Jeff an email with a link to this in hopes he will come on & clear this up if it is a simple case he is also the victim of a fraud on a large scale??

Frank - I've always found you very helpful and am sure you are trying to look after the best interests of the hobby.

I don't have a dog in this fight (I have 2 baggies - both worth a couple of pints of beer). I'm surprised you didn't contact Jeff before doing this - I'd have thought that would be the first thing to do?

 

[Vin3po]

Some of the bags posted are really bad and not good if he sold questionable baggies after the fact he was told they where fake.

The evidence is not looking good and even if Jeff wasn't making these baggies himself he should have 110% been questioning them from whoever he was getting them from.

 

[lee gray]

I dont know who jeff is even

However guilty or not i do think the right thing to do was let him know before posting this. Not that he should be allowed time to try to make excuses but just on the very off chance he is innocent

 

[xbomber]

I dont know who jeff is even

However guilty or not i do think the right thing to do was let him know before posting this. Not that he should be allowed time to try to make excuses but just on the very off chance he is innocent

Can't disagree with you but it's academic now and any attempt to close this particular Pandoras Box could generate confusion for folks who are even now finding this thread.

 

[mr_palitoy]

Another real shame for the hobby. Nice work by Frank and co uncovering it all. I've always stayed away from baggies as they struck me as far too easy to fake. Now we know...

Jason

 

[Bonsai_Tree_Ent]

Frank, the R5-D4 that you said was on ebay right now.

I just took a look: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-Star-Wars-R5-D4-Sealed-SW-a-Baggie-1978-Very-Nice-Rare-/252714327669?hash=item3ad6f29e75%3Ag%3A7T0AAOSwA3dYXIkv&nma=true&si=RVHwzjVsRRZUFT0%252FbJ4TD%252B%252B60is%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

Listing's been ended today. But it wasn't being sold by Jeff but by another seller - is this one that had originally come from Jeff?

Also, is Jeff a member on this forum?

 

[lee gray]

Another real shame for the hobby. Nice work by Frank and co uncovering it all. I've always stayed away from baggies as they struck me as far too easy to fake. Now we know...

Jason

And knowings half the battle.......oops wrong toyline !

 

[Bonsai_Tree_Ent]

I think this thread highlights the importance of keeping records of all your purchases and all your sales.

I very much hope that anyone who has bought a baggie that is 'wrong' will be given the return / refund option.

 

[Ross_Barr]

Too early to dub this "*********gieGate"?

 

[Stuart Skinner]

Why has one of the collectors names who've investigated this been removed from opening post. The one removed is a huge Baggie expert, any reason why he's disappeared???

 

[Bonsai_Tree_Ent]

The one removed is a huge Baggie expert, any reason why he's disappeared???

Yep, he can name every West Brom player going back to 1967.

 

[Bunglebubs]

Too early to dub this "*********gieGate"?

:lol: :lol:

 

[Lom]

I must confess that I am somewhat flabbergasted that all those involved with this 'expose' didn't think it appropriate to confront Jeff privately first. I realise that the evidence appears damning but it's not absolutely conclusive that he is manufacturing and distributing these things; what is conclusive however, is that Jeff's reputation in this hobby is now in shreds.

Great work with the investigation; phenomenal work from you all, but I don't feel particularly comfortable with the way the unmasking's been handled.

 

[indianawars]

It would be interesting to see if any of these suspect Baggies have been graded?

 

[SOJ]

It would be interesting to see if any of these suspect Baggies have been graded?

I'm willing to bet the farm they have.

 

[Michael Sith]

Lest we forget ....the collectors bringing this to our attention are " passionate" in the extreme for the hobby and specifically in regard to baggies. It is easy to comment, not so easy to put yourself out there with conviction as has been done here for the greater good.

The post was started with the words ... It is with great sadness..... The person in question was catergorically told that some items were fake, but still put them up for sale again, it sounds like the scale of the situation is quite frightening and damaging to the hobby.

For these reasons alone this had to be put out there.

A constant gripe in today's collecting market is greed and fakes and anything that turns the tide in anyway should be supported, should it not? Damn right it should in my book!

 

[theforceuk]

I've never had any interest in baggies either, apart from the Woolworths 8 pack which I did get as a kid.

But still reading through parts of this thread just makes me so sad.

The **** people get up to, I feel sorry for you, I really I do.

 

[Clarkspie&chips]

Here's a few pics of the bossk mailer I bought at FF last year. I'm fairly certain it was from Jeff but his stall was very close to another so I cannot be 100%.

I'm certainly no expert on baggies and only bought this to compliment my Bossk focus, it appears to have the correct SW-a baggie but close ups of the font look disturbingly similar to the fakes shown earlier.

The bag is crinkly and is heat sealed. Frank, if you need better pictures to update your guide please just ask.

 

[Stuart Skinner]

Lest we forget ....the collectors bringing this to our attention are " passionate" in the extreme for the hobby and specifically in regard to baggies. It is easy to comment, not so easy to put yourself out there with conviction as has been done here for the greater good!

One of them, and one who I'd say is a well respected Baggie expert though has been removed, someone who visited and look at his stock. Why has his name been removed? I'm wondering if he doesn't agree with everything being said or perhaps the way it's being handled but would be interested in an explanation why he's been removed from the initial comments.

I must confess that I am somewhat flabbergasted that all those involved with this 'expose' didn't think it appropriate to confront Jeff privately first. I realise that the evidence appears damning but it's not absolutely conclusive that he is manufacturing and distributing these things; what is conclusive however, is that Jeff's reputation in this hobby is now in shreds.

I'm in the same boat as Martins comments, doesn't sit well with me either, I'd like to have thought they'd approach the bloke first and seek out what his comments were, whether he has done anything dubious or not no longer matters now, his name has been dragged through the mud and if he is innocent then this will always be connected to him.

I hope it's factual for initial post as this post is massively slanderous.

 

[naughtyjedi]

I must confess that I am somewhat flabbergasted that all those involved with this 'expose' didn't think it appropriate to confront Jeff privately first. I realise that the evidence appears damning but it's not absolutely conclusive that he is manufacturing and distributing these things; what is conclusive however, is that Jeff's reputation in this hobby is now in shreds.

I'm in the same boat as Martins comments, doesn't sit well with me either, I'd like to have thought they'd approach the bloke first and seek out what his comments were, whether he has done anything dubious or not no longer matters now, his name has been dragged through the mud and if he is innocent then this will always be connected to him.

I hope it's factual for initial post as this post is massively slanderous.

Im in the same boat here. I'm perturbed this thread has happened the way it has. This has been trial by forum, and Jeff has been hung drawn and quartered. Its not like he's not prepared to talk. Be different if it was someone aloof like Toy Toni. Real bad taste in the mouth. I said late yesterday this place is like home. It is, but I just walked in on grandad shagging the family dog. I can't unsee that image...