A question for the Star Wars book I’m writing: Kenner stock.

[Simply Sci-fi]

I am putting the finishing touches to my book, "Star Wars in the U.K", which I am hoping to release in May. I am covering the subject of Star Wars toys of course but there is still information missing from my knowledge.

A good deal of Kenner stock was sold in the U.K, with some of it I believe imported privately by some shops and particularly market stalls. My 1978 Palitoy T.I.E Fighter is a Kenner boxed item with Palitoy stickers covering the Kenner logos which is a bit of a mystery. A great number of Kenner carded figures were sold in the U.K with Palitoy competition stickers on the reverse. Also Kenner Speeder Bikes, Mini Rigs, Jabba the Hutt play sets, Scout Walkers and other items were sold in the U.K in 1983 in the wake of Return of the Jedi. The only new big boxed items Palitoy released that year were the Scout Walker and Rebel Transport. Does anyone have a clear idea of how and why Kenner stock ended up being sold in the U.K?

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Craig.

 

[JuniorChubb]

I would guess to meet demand and save costs...

But there are people on here who are a lot more knowledgeable on the subject and they might give you answers instead of guesses.

 

[Palifan]

I am putting the finishing touches to my book, "Star Wars in the U.K", which I am hoping to release in May. I am covering the subject of Star Wars toys of course but there is still information missing from my knowledge.

A good deal of Kenner stock was sold in the U.K, with some of it I believe imported privately by some shops and particularly market stalls. My 1978 Palitoy T.I.E Fighter is a Kenner boxed item with Palitoy stickers covering the Kenner logos which is a bit of a mystery. A great number of Kenner carded figures were sold in the U.K with Palitoy competition stickers on the reverse. Also Kenner Speeder Bikes, Mini Rigs, Jabba the Hutt play sets, Scout Walkers and other items were sold in the U.K in 1983 in the wake of Return of the Jedi. The only new big boxed items Palitoy released that year were the Scout Walker and Rebel Transport. Does anyone have a clear idea of how and why Kenner stock ended up being sold in the U.K?

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Craig.

I can only guess it was the demand and certain things not being available in the UK at the time. I had a vinyl cape Jawa growing up as a child which I always thought was Palitoy (same as my other 12 backs), but there was a lot of doubt about this and people thought it was a Kenner one sent over from the states. After the recent find of two of these sealed last year at least we know now that Palitoy did make them even though I'll never know for sure if mine was indeed Kenner. The Yoda I had growing up however had an orange snake and as we know Palitoy didn't release this version until much later than ESB it must have been Kenner ( I think this is quite common for this figure).

As said earlier I'm sure someone will be able to help you out a bit more but here's a link to a UK childhood collection which shows you some of the range of Kenner card backs that made it to the UK back in the day -

http://www.starwarsforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=18418

Look forward to seeing the book and be sure to post a link to it with some pictures once it's finished.

Ian

 

[Grant_C]

TIE Pilot was in the last group of figures released on ESB.

There are no examples of a TFP on a ROTJ Palitoy card- but lots of examples on a Kenner card with palitoy sticker.

 

[theslider]

Also remember that Palitoy carded figures also made their way across the Atlantic to be sold in the states - mainly Trilogos but also others cf the Palitoy CCP in the vintage valuation forum.

 

[Fishtalk]

Can only echo what others have said, I assume Palitoy could not produce enough figures to meet the demand so imported Kenner stock.
It was all Palitoy until the first wave of Empire figures, then Kenner cards appeared regularly. If you check my collection above (thanks for the link, Ian) it's about 70% Palitoy cards. Most of these figures were bought in Staffordshire, I presume the rest of the U.K was the same.
Anyway, looking forward to the book.

 

[mr_palitoy]

I am putting the finishing touches to my book, "Star Wars in the U.K", which I am hoping to release in May. I am covering the subject of Star Wars toys of course but there is still information missing from my knowledge.

A good deal of Kenner stock was sold in the U.K, with some of it I believe imported privately by some shops and particularly market stalls. My 1978 Palitoy T.I.E Fighter is a Kenner boxed item with Palitoy stickers covering the Kenner logos which is a bit of a mystery. A great number of Kenner carded figures were sold in the U.K with Palitoy competition stickers on the reverse. Also Kenner Speeder Bikes, Mini Rigs, Jabba the Hutt play sets, Scout Walkers and other items were sold in the U.K in 1983 in the wake of Return of the Jedi. The only new big boxed items Palitoy released that year were the Scout Walker and Rebel Transport. Does anyone have a clear idea of how and why Kenner stock ended up being sold in the U.K?

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Craig.

I can only guess it was the demand and certain things not being available in the UK at the time. I had a vinyl cape Jawa growing up as a child which I always thought was Palitoy (same as my other 12 backs), but there was a lot of doubt about this and people thought it was a Kenner one sent over from the states. After the recent find of two of these sealed last year at least we know now that Palitoy did make them even though I'll never know for sure if mine was indeed Kenner. The Yoda I had growing up however had an orange snake and as we know Palitoy didn't release this version until much later than ESB it must have been Kenner ( I think this is quite common for this figure).

As said earlier I'm sure someone will be able to help you out a bit more but here's a link to a UK childhood collection which shows you some of the range of Kenner card backs that made it to the UK back in the day -

http://www.starwarsforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=18418

Look forward to seeing the book and be sure to post a link to it with some pictures once it's finished.

Ian

The early Palitoy and Kenner cards were both manufactured and assembled at the Kader Industries factory in Hong Kong and sent back to Coalville UK and
Kenner factories in the USA. Hence why the figures are the same, and the bubbles used are the same, Very noticeable on Jawa with transition from vinyl bubble,
to R2D2 bubble to cloth cape bubble.

So when there was a shortage of Palitoy cards, especially Jawa, then they sent Kenner cards instead. So it's unlikely that Kenner cards were sent from Kenner factories
in the USA to the UK when there were shortages.



cheers Jason

 

[Simply Sci-fi]

Very useful information.

Are we saying here that the backing cards were not manufactured by Palitoy and that sometimes they were sent Kenner cards? Palitoy had stickers made to cover over the competition details.

In the same way the white T.I.E Fighter and the 1983 vehicles and accessories were assembled and boxed by Palitoy but they were sent Kenner packaging? That would make a lot more sense than whole boxed Kenner items being shipped to the U.K.

Craig.

 

[Palifan]

The early Palitoy and Kenner cards were both manufactured and assembled at the Kader Industries factory in Hong Kong and sent back to Coalville UK and
Kenner factories in the USA. Hence why the figures are the same, and the bubbles used are the same, Very noticeable on Jawa with transition from vinyl bubble,
to R2D2 bubble to cloth cape bubble.

So when there was a shortage of Palitoy cards, especially Jawa, then they sent Kenner cards instead. So it's unlikely that Kenner cards were sent from Kenner factories
in the USA to the UK when there were shortages.



cheers Jason[/quote]

Very interesting information Jason, I never even knew about this Kader factory until you mentioned it on your other thread about 41 backs.

The one thing I don't quite understand is that you say the early figures ( 12 back to ?) were produced and assembled in the Kader factory and then sent to the UK and US. I've looked over these figures and packaging for years now and noticed that there is often a different bubble placement on the Palitoy and Kenner ones. Maybe this is because some of the 12 back Kenner ones were made in other factories? Also I always thought the parts were sent to Palitoy for assembly but does this mean that this was never the case on the early issue ones and that Palitoy never printed any packaging ( I guess that would stand to reason as it's probably more cost effective to get the printing and manufacturing produced else where).

Great work as ever though jason and it would be good to hear a bit more to fill in some gaps in my knowledge on all of this.

Ian

 

[mr_palitoy]

The early Palitoy and Kenner cards were both manufactured and assembled at the Kader Industries factory in Hong Kong and sent back to Coalville UK and
Kenner factories in the USA. Hence why the figures are the same, and the bubbles used are the same, Very noticeable on Jawa with transition from vinyl bubble,
to R2D2 bubble to cloth cape bubble.

So when there was a shortage of Palitoy cards, especially Jawa, then they sent Kenner cards instead. So it's unlikely that Kenner cards were sent from Kenner factories
in the USA to the UK when there were shortages.



cheers Jason

Very interesting information Jason, I never even knew about this Kader factory until you mentioned it on your other thread about 41 backs.

The one thing I don't quite understand is that you say the early figures ( 12 back to ?) were produced and assembled in the Kader factory and then sent to the UK and US. I've looked over these figures and packaging for years now and noticed that there is often a different bubble placement on the Palitoy and Kenner ones. Maybe this is because some of the 12 back Kenner ones were made in other factories? Also I always thought the parts were sent to Palitoy for assembly but does this mean that this was never the case on the early issue ones and that Palitoy never printed any packaging ( I guess that would stand to reason as it's probably more cost effective to get the printing and manufacturing produced else where).

Great work as ever though jason and it would be good to hear a bit more to fill in some gaps in my knowledge on all of this.

Ian[/quote]

The cards all say Made In Hong Kong, and guess what, they were! What would be the point of making the figures, cards and bubbles and then not assembling them in
the Hong Kong factory? The first cards that were printed and assembled in Coalville was the 45b, which is the first card variation in the unused stock Toni got hold of.
The 3 bubble types used on 12 back Jawa are the same for Palitoy and Kenner, so they were assembled in the same factory in Hong Kong. It's possible other Hong Kong
factories were used, they were for Kenner. The HN factory code used perforated punches and these can be seen on early cards like 30a, 41an and 41bn, so thats another
indication of a different factory as well as bubble placement.



cheers Jason

 

[mr_palitoy]

Very useful information.

Are we saying here that the backing cards were not manufactured by Palitoy and that sometimes they were sent Kenner cards? Palitoy had stickers made to cover over the competition details.

In the same way the white T.I.E Fighter and the 1983 vehicles and accessories were assembled and boxed by Palitoy but they were sent Kenner packaging? That would make a lot more sense than whole boxed Kenner items being shipped to the U.K.

Craig.

Yes, the first Palitoy cards made in Coalville UK was the 45b, along with the German and Clipper ESB 45 backs.

The palitoy stickers on 45b cards were made in Coalville to cover up Dutch and German writing on the back when they used German and Clipper cards because there were shortages. The palitoy stickers on Kenner 48 backs could have been applied either end, some Kenner cards were sold with no stickers in the UK, so they ran out of them quite often. Same is true for the Palitoy stickers on boxed vehicles. Stickers more likely to have been applied in the UK, I would think.

For vehicles, Palitoy got hold of some spare Kenner moulds for the early Star Wars stuff, but they left the Kenner copyright on them and they werent as fancy.
See palitoy 12a/12b cardback where they had to remove flashing lights and sound effects on the landspeeder and tie fighter blurb.

Other vehicles they couldnt get moulds for so they made crappy cardboard versions like land of the jawas, cantina bar and death star.

Given Palitoy werent printing figure cards in the early days, it makes sense that they werent printing the packaging either. Thats why they had to sticker up the Tie Fighter
box, as all they got sent were Kenner flats.

cheers Jason

 

[Palifan]

Very interesting information Jason, I never even knew about this Kader factory until you mentioned it on your other thread about 41 backs.

The one thing I don't quite understand is that you say the early figures ( 12 back to ?) were produced and assembled in the Kader factory and then sent to the UK and US. I've looked over these figures and packaging for years now and noticed that there is often a different bubble placement on the Palitoy and Kenner ones. Maybe this is because some of the 12 back Kenner ones were made in other factories? Also I always thought the parts were sent to Palitoy for assembly but does this mean that this was never the case on the early issue ones and that Palitoy never printed any packaging ( I guess that would stand to reason as it's probably more cost effective to get the printing and manufacturing produced else where).

Great work as ever though jason and it would be good to hear a bit more to fill in some gaps in my knowledge on all of this.

Ian[/quote]

The cards all say Made In Hong Kong, and guess what, they were! What would be the point of making the figures, cards and bubbles and then not assembling them in
the Hong Kong factory? The first cards that were printed and assembled in Coalville was the 45b, which is the first card variation in the unused stock Toni got hold of.
The 3 bubble types used on 12 back Jawa are the same for Palitoy and Kenner, so they were assembled in the same factory in Hong Kong. It's possible other Hong Kong
factories were used, they were for Kenner. The HN factory code used perforated punches and these can be seen on early cards like 30a, 41an and 41bn, so thats another
indication of a different factory as well as bubble placement.



cheers Jason[/quote]

Thanks Jason for clearing that all up. It makes you wonder what Palitoy were really doing back in the day as they seem to be more a middle man selling Kenners products, although I guess there was some sort of deal set up so that in the UK they wanted the Palitoy logo rather than Kenner (even though they were both being produced in the same HK factory). I'm really not sure how things are allowed to be sold in different countries but I guess at the time the deal was that it had to have the Palitoy name on it. Maybe this is because Palitoy was a recognized name in the UK and Kenner thought it would sell better over her carrying it.

One point I will disagree with though is the UK issue of the Death Star being a crappy cardboard set. That set was my most played with toy of my entire childhood and is way better than the US version for my money. The box is amazing and it's definitely one case where bigger is better!

Ian

 

[mr_palitoy]

Coalville was a full blown factory, not just a middle man. Action figures was just one component of the star wars line. As well as vehcles and playsets, they also
had board games, full size guns/sabers etc and a bunch of other misc stuff, so I don't think they were being lazy! Hong Kong had a 1000+ toy factories at that time
so they farmed stuff out and imported when it was cheaper to do, they didnt have the equipment to manufacture themselves or the capacity.



Jason

 

[Palifan]

Coalville was a full blown factory, not just a middle man. Action figures was just one component of the star wars line. As well as vehcles and playsets, they also
had board games, full size guns/sabers etc and a bunch of other misc stuff, so I don't think they were being lazy! Hong Kong had a 1000+ toy factories at that time
so they farmed stuff out and imported when it was cheaper to do, they didnt have the equipment to manufacture themselves or the capacity.



Jason

I wasn't claiming they were lazy I was just talking about when Star Wars first hit the UK shelves. The reason I remember the Palitoy logo so well was because I first had action man figures from them and remembered the adverts so well (even though I always thought they sung 'from Palitoy' at the end and not just said it) -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZCnRtMXYTA

Ian

 

[mr_palitoy]

And they made action man, dolls, and a shitload of non star wars stuff obviously.



Jason

 

[Palifan]

And they made action man, dolls, and a shitload of non star wars stuff obviously.



Jason

That goes without saying, I just wish I'd kept hold of my fist fighter Palitoy/(mego) Spiderman, the packaging was amazing! It's such a shame it closed it's doors all that time ago and now we pretty much have Hasbro left with it's generic packaging and (some), quite cheap looking products.

ian

 

[Simply Sci-fi]

So we have toys that were manufactured in Hong Kong as pieces, assembled by Palitoy but were provided with Kenner packaging; White T.I.E Fighters. Boba Fett 12" figures (I have never seen a Palitoy box), the post-movie 1983 Return of the Jedi vehicle and accessory range. The Kenner Landspeeder turns up in the U.K which may have been Palitoy receiving a batch designed for Kenner. Alternatively it may have been shops/market stalls making their own arrangements to ship much sought after stock into the U.K in 1978. The vehicles were so highly sought after they might just as well have been made of gold.

I have a MOC Kenner Yoda 32 back which was supposed to be U.K ex-shop stock. I assume that Palitoy received the Kenner figures and accessories along with the backing cards ready for assembly. Kenner version Twin Pod Cloud Cars in the dark red colour turn up in the U.K as well, which I suppose Palitoy received in pieces from Hong Kong along with the corresponding Kenner box.

It seems as if that the Palitoy facility was primarily geared towards assembly. It was more cost-effective to have Hong Kong produce all of the pieces/packaging and ship them to the U.K than it was to assemble in Hong Kong and then to ship the bulky finished items. Even action figures must have been a hell of a lot cheaper to assemble in a U.K facility because the individual pieces take up less space.

My first ROTJ figures were all Kenner including Princess Leia Boushh and General Madine (I'm looking at the Boushh card right this second). I found them in a newsagent shop well in advance of the regular stores in 1983. They may have been resourced by the shopkeeper outside of the normal channels. I wouldn't be surprised because they were over-priced, to say the least!

Craig.

 

[mr_palitoy]

The landspeeder was a kenner mould that was sent to the Coalville factory in the UK, they couldnt change the mould so the Kenner copyright stayed.
If the factory that produced Kenner landspeeders had sent those to the UK, then they would have had sound effects etc.

cheers Jason

 

[mr_palitoy]

Action figures were assembled in Hong Kong and sent back to Coalville. Labour is cheap in Asia, less so in the UK.

cheers Jason

 

[Simply Sci-fi]

Very useful information.

Landspeeders complete with Kenner box and opening hood (there was no sound effect) do turn up over here, which might have been imported outside of Palitoy, if the company had its own mould.

I have just taken a close look at my Kenner Princess Leia Boushh. It has an identical bubble to the first Palitoy variation bubble. http://www.freewebs.com/mrpalitoy/rotj65acardback.htm It seems that it was assembled and carded by Palitoy.

The Kenner versions I have spotted on Google all have bubbles with massive rims which extend way over the logo.
http://www.starwarstoymuseum.com/princess-leia-boushh.htm

Is this a new variation; Kenner figure and card but Palitoy bubble? Could prove to be interesting. When I next visit my collection in storage I'll take a close look at all of the Kenner bubbles.

Craig.