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Rate TLJ out of ten
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<blockquote data-quote="Snaketibe" data-source="post: 507732" data-attributes="member: 7379"><p>I of course agree with you completely about George Lucas changing the overall OT story specifics as he went along, as well as re-writing history numerous times since (anyone remember when Star Wars was going to have 12 episodes? Then when it was 9? Then when it was only ever going to have 6? ;-)). I know my Star Wars history, however in fairness to Lucas, I'm sure he had the gist of what he wanted to make and the general direction the story would take pretty early on, even if the specific path meandered this way and that away from the original kernel of his idea. Famously for example, Gary Kurtz felt Lucas was more interested in getting toy opportunities on screen by the time Return of the Jedi came along than he was about making the best film that he could, and hence they parted ways due to these 'creative differences'. Despite that though, it remained one person's vision from start to finish, and even the prequels are more or less consistent with the original trilogy, for all their other many faults, for that reason.</p><p></p><p>The sequel trilogy by contrast has all the hallmarks of being rushed into production by a greedy Disney eyeing dollar signs, before being properly prepared, and certainly without an overall story arc. And to have each episode written and directed by individuals who are not beholden to such an overall arc is a jaw-droppingly bad way of handling such a valuable IP. Risky doesn't even begin to describe it! Yes, as previously acknowledged, some fans like TLJ (I genuinely don't know why, but I accept the fact that they do and respect their perfect right to do so), but Disney have managed to piss off and alienate a lot of fans like me; a life-long Star Wars fan from the age of 6 in 1978. Until TLJ came out, I never dreamt the day would come when I not only wouldn't be excited about a new Star Wars film coming out, but I would also have no intention of going to see it. And with respect, that isn't me being ****ing crazy, that's me not being a ****ing masochist.</p><p></p><p>I truly, deeply and utterly despise what Rian Johnson was allowed to do to Star Wars, and anything short of Episode IX beginning with Rey awaking on Ackh To in front of a very much still alive Luke Skywalker, having just experienced the entirety of TLJ in the form of a dark force vision sent by Snoke, won't satisfy me. Disney won't do that of course, because to do so would be to acknowledge how unsatisfactory TLJ was (and pissing off half your fan base, even if the other half adores the piece, is massively unsatisfactory for Disney because they're losing customers and hence revenue).</p><p></p><p>JJ has to make the best of the dog's breakfast left by Johnson, and since TLJ won't be wiped from the canon by making it a Bobby Ewing in the shower moment, it means it remains part of the canon. That in turn means that if I watch IX, not only am I rewarding Disney for making a **** film, pissing me off and then insulting me to boot, I also have to accept TLJ as canon, and I have absolutely no wish to do that as I detest it so much. Rogue One and (to a lesser extent) Solo aside, for me the Star Wars saga beyond Return of the Jedi remains what it was for many perfectly satisfactory years; in book form in the numerous Expanded Universe stories started by Timothy Zahn's 'Heir to the Empire' trilogy, and concluding with the end of the now rebranded 'Legends' stories. I don't require anything further from Disney in the Star Wars sequel film department. They've had my money for the first two, disappointed me, and don't deserve another penny of it.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Snaketibe, post: 507732, member: 7379"] I of course agree with you completely about George Lucas changing the overall OT story specifics as he went along, as well as re-writing history numerous times since (anyone remember when Star Wars was going to have 12 episodes? Then when it was 9? Then when it was only ever going to have 6? ;-)). I know my Star Wars history, however in fairness to Lucas, I'm sure he had the gist of what he wanted to make and the general direction the story would take pretty early on, even if the specific path meandered this way and that away from the original kernel of his idea. Famously for example, Gary Kurtz felt Lucas was more interested in getting toy opportunities on screen by the time Return of the Jedi came along than he was about making the best film that he could, and hence they parted ways due to these 'creative differences'. Despite that though, it remained one person's vision from start to finish, and even the prequels are more or less consistent with the original trilogy, for all their other many faults, for that reason. The sequel trilogy by contrast has all the hallmarks of being rushed into production by a greedy Disney eyeing dollar signs, before being properly prepared, and certainly without an overall story arc. And to have each episode written and directed by individuals who are not beholden to such an overall arc is a jaw-droppingly bad way of handling such a valuable IP. Risky doesn't even begin to describe it! Yes, as previously acknowledged, some fans like TLJ (I genuinely don't know why, but I accept the fact that they do and respect their perfect right to do so), but Disney have managed to piss off and alienate a lot of fans like me; a life-long Star Wars fan from the age of 6 in 1978. Until TLJ came out, I never dreamt the day would come when I not only wouldn't be excited about a new Star Wars film coming out, but I would also have no intention of going to see it. And with respect, that isn't me being ****ing crazy, that's me not being a ****ing masochist. I truly, deeply and utterly despise what Rian Johnson was allowed to do to Star Wars, and anything short of Episode IX beginning with Rey awaking on Ackh To in front of a very much still alive Luke Skywalker, having just experienced the entirety of TLJ in the form of a dark force vision sent by Snoke, won't satisfy me. Disney won't do that of course, because to do so would be to acknowledge how unsatisfactory TLJ was (and pissing off half your fan base, even if the other half adores the piece, is massively unsatisfactory for Disney because they're losing customers and hence revenue). JJ has to make the best of the dog's breakfast left by Johnson, and since TLJ won't be wiped from the canon by making it a Bobby Ewing in the shower moment, it means it remains part of the canon. That in turn means that if I watch IX, not only am I rewarding Disney for making a **** film, pissing me off and then insulting me to boot, I also have to accept TLJ as canon, and I have absolutely no wish to do that as I detest it so much. Rogue One and (to a lesser extent) Solo aside, for me the Star Wars saga beyond Return of the Jedi remains what it was for many perfectly satisfactory years; in book form in the numerous Expanded Universe stories started by Timothy Zahn's 'Heir to the Empire' trilogy, and concluding with the end of the now rebranded 'Legends' stories. I don't require anything further from Disney in the Star Wars sequel film department. They've had my money for the first two, disappointed me, and don't deserve another penny of it. [/QUOTE]
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