Potential Han Bespin Toni

Not sure if this is the right place to post this or if there are existing thread but here he go:

Took a punt on a potential Tony at the weekend and was hoping some could help me validate.

Photo 2

Photo 4

As the rear of the card has no "collect all 45" in English, is this enough to confirm it is not a Toni ? Also in next picture shows 2 dimples on the bubble also noted on shop bought figures show on other threads.

Taking my palitoy 45b knowledge here and applying to ESB German cards where the same process/bubbles were used in Coalville.

Most of Tonis German unused cards were with the english text, but some of the figures had cards without the text.

For Han Bespin, the cards Toni had are without text as the majority of minty cards out there are of this type. Toni had 162 of these cards.
You can tell from a front only shot as with text has a v shape on the punch, whereas without is rounded.

Bubbles should either be double stemmed:-



The fact that this bubble has yellowed would indicate its genuine as Tonis are always clear.

Or bubbles should be single stemmed with an 0N number in the bottom right hand corner:-



You can just about make out the leading 0 on that example.

Your bubble has no number on it like this example taken from Toni's website:-



Also, your bubble show signs of lifting and air pockets, and signs of iron/heat damage to the bubble on the right hand edge.

So all in I would say it was a Toni.

Not sure about that double dots thing. Do you know where it was said that meant it was genuine? Those dots could have been
put there during the bubble manufacturing process in my opinion.

Let me know what you think.

cheers Jason

Is there also paint missing from the right hand?

On the link below In the update post, down at point 8 if describes shop bought examples with the 2 dimples.

There is also example of an At At driver examined with matching dipples to my Han.

It's all very confusing, reading the threads it led me to believe card backs with no English text were genuine. Then talk of the dimples.

Nothing lost though I only bought it out of interest. Will keep it as a reminder of how devious some people can be (allegedly)

http://www.starwarsforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=18756&start=30#p264616

Here's the at at driver with matching dimples

http://www.starwarsforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=18756&start=15#p263948

That At-At driver is also a Toni in my opinion, no number on the bubble and tell take air pockets, also purchased directly from Toni which is a bit if a giveaway.

I was the one who originally thought that all Toni's German cards had English text on the back. That looks incorrect now, cards are either all with or without English text depending on the figure.

Cheers Jason

Looks just like my assumed Toni Stormtrooper with a dimpled bubble.

I'm guessing yours is a Toni too, though I'm not convinced that air bubbles are a tell - plenty of Kenners with those

Even so I wouldn't do anything hasty, if dimples and unnumbered bubbles are shown to be shop bought we might have to rethink things - but I'm not holding my breath

The seller on eBay has agreed to take it back and provide a full refund.

It's a shame cause if it is the real deal it's a beautiful card, really glossy and bright. Think I'll take the money though and sink it into a real Kenner one.

Just a point but I bought a Han Solo and Han Bespin both on German Palitoy cards around 10 years ago. They both had 03 bubbles.

Both bought from TT.

Captainsolo1978 said:

Just a point but I bought a Han Solo and Han Bespin both on German Palitoy cards around 10 years ago. They both had 03 bubbles.

Both bought from TT.

Click to expand...

Toni had a supply of 03 bubbles, I think it's the only numbered bubble he had. Genuine Han Solo used 04 and I havent got a bubble number for Han Bespin yet.

cheers Jason

Yes I bought the AT-AT Driver from Toni, only the one though so lucky for me I guess. So those dimples mean its a fake?

rob71 said:

Yes I bought the AT-AT Driver from Toni, only the one though so lucky for me I guess. So those dimples mean its a fake?

Click to expand...

The dimpled cards I have seen are Toni's, others have claimed to have shop sold examples with dimples but I haven't seen one yet. To me, those dimples look like part if the bubble manufacturing process rather than as a result of being sealed to a card, so both the factory and Toni may have had bubbles with that flaw.

Cheers Jason

Happy ending, got my money back and got a Kenner 41 back Han Bespin this week. The card is not as nice but it's much more satisfying knowing its pucker.

Thanks to Jason for the clarification. This rookie has learnt his lesson.

SonOfJango said:

Happy ending, got my money back and got a Kenner 41 back Han Bespin this week. The card is not as nice but it's much more satisfying knowing its pucker.

Thanks to Jason for the clarification. This rookie has learnt his lesson.

Click to expand...

A happy outcome, always nice to see.



Jason

Glad to hear!

SOAB has relisted it denying its a Tony

http://bit.ly/1s4PCF4

SonOfJango said:

SOAB has relisted it denying its a Tony

http://bit.ly/1s4PCF4

Click to expand...

I don't think he is denying its a toni, I think that pathetic line is his disclaimer. If the same thing happens as last time and it gets bought and then the buyer realises the issue with these cards and seeks a refund he will just point them to that line and say he told them to look into it first.

Toni sold to dealers and collectors in huge quantity. There are so many out there that have been through several peoples hands. I imagine this will be purchased and then end up on ebay later with no disclaimer at all. Looks like you got a lucky escape there mate.